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Any polywell news?

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:10 pm
by jsbiff
Hi,

So, I've not been around for awhile. Last I checked in, the word was we were/are supposed to get some sort of news about Polywell in late fall or winter. Well, it's almost winter, so I thought I'd check. I don't see any headlines here about Polywell (just LENR/E-cat), so I suppose that means nothing yet.

Do we have any kind of more precise deadline or expectation of when we will learn anything new about Polywell?

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:34 pm
by 93143
The recovery.gov project tracker thread has seen a bit of action lately; there's a reason for this. Check it out.

Re: Any polywell news?

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:36 pm
by KitemanSA
jsbiff wrote:Hi,
Do we have any kind of more precise deadline or expectation of when we will learn anything new about Polywell?
Not really. They seem to be going ever more and more "dark" about this stuff. Tis distressing!

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:52 pm
by 93143
All right, I'll be more explicit. They've posted an update. Turns out the "final report submitted" box probably shouldn't have been checked last time.
As of 3Q/2011, the WB-8 device has generated over 500 high power plasma shots. EMC2 is conducting tests on Wiffle-Ball plasma scaling law on plasma heating and confinement.
http://www.recovery.gov/Transparency/Re ... pId=212569

It's not a lot, but it's not nothing.

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:58 pm
by jsbiff
"As of 3Q/2011, the WB-8 device has generated over 500 high power plasma shots."

Does this mean they just create a millisecond pulse and measure data? It doesn't sound like they've run the device in anything like a constant power production mode? I suppose if they're testing scaling, short pulses might make more sense.

Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 8:00 pm
by mvanwink5
Reports on the recovery.gov project site have been brief.
http://www.recovery.gov/Transparency/Re ... pId=309748
Basically, confinement is said to be excellent and they have run 500 tests to date. There is some hope that the testing should conclude by years end with WB-8.1 project extension as the next step.

Alan Boyle had an interview with Dr. Park, who is now running EMC2 with Dr. Nebel's retirement after first WB-8 plasma last November. Reported delays have been said to be due to testing tracking funds, rather than the ideal situation of funds tracking experimentation schedule.

Hopes generally are optimistic here based on thin reports. There is some uncertainty on what will be reported if there is success, with some hope that initiation of WB-8.1 will be visible.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 2:31 am
by happyjack27
Alan Boyle had an interview with Dr. Park, who is now running EMC2 with Dr. Nebel's retirement after first WB-8 plasma last November. Reported delays have been said to be due to testing tracking funds, rather than the ideal situation of funds tracking experimentation schedule.
ah, so government bureaucracy is slowing everything down? surprise surprise.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 2:42 am
by mvanwink5
It is not to say that fund timing is the predominant delay, there may be other important delay causes, after all this is research and it was mentioned in the article that sometimes issues can be resolved and sometimes they can't. It is hard to tell if that point was theoretical or was in reference to efforts to work through device issues. Just saying.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 2:43 am
by icarus
happyjack27 wrote:
Alan Boyle had an interview with Dr. Park, who is now running EMC2 with Dr. Nebel's retirement after first WB-8 plasma last November. Reported delays have been said to be due to testing tracking funds, rather than the ideal situation of funds tracking experimentation schedule.
ah, so government bureaucracy is slowing everything down? surprise surprise.
Not quite. Not enough money is how I read that. Or if you were a pessimist, it is costing too much to test.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 3:45 am
by rcain
by the way, do we know anything definitive about the notional WB8.1 (its size, power for example)?

i don't mean just 'guesses'.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:31 am
by MSimon
rcain wrote:by the way, do we know anything definitive about the notional WB8.1 (its size, power for example)?

i don't mean just 'guesses'.
It is my understanding that they will be adding some eqpt. to the WB8. Thus WB8.1.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 6:57 pm
by happyjack27
icarus wrote:
happyjack27 wrote:
Alan Boyle had an interview with Dr. Park, who is now running EMC2 with Dr. Nebel's retirement after first WB-8 plasma last November. Reported delays have been said to be due to testing tracking funds, rather than the ideal situation of funds tracking experimentation schedule.
ah, so government bureaucracy is slowing everything down? surprise surprise.
Not quite. Not enough money is how I read that. Or if you were a pessimist, it is costing too much to test.
but time IS money!

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 6:58 pm
by happyjack27
mvanwink5 wrote:It is not to say that fund timing is the predominant delay, there may be other important delay causes, after all this is research and it was mentioned in the article that sometimes issues can be resolved and sometimes they can't. It is hard to tell if that point was theoretical or was in reference to efforts to work through device issues. Just saying.
well yeah, you "resolve it", and then what do you do? you wait for funding. "hurry up and wait" by any other name is still "hurry up and wait".

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 7:01 pm
by happyjack27
rcain wrote:by the way, do we know anything definitive about the notional WB8.1 (its size, power for example)?

i don't mean just 'guesses'.
my understanding is that WB8.1 will be using the same magrid as WB8. they'll be making some modifications to the electron gun, and trying p-b11 fuel. presumably they'll be increasing the power. obviously they're not increasing the size if they're using the same magrid.

Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 10:32 pm
by ScottL
icarus wrote:
happyjack27 wrote:
Alan Boyle had an interview with Dr. Park, who is now running EMC2 with Dr. Nebel's retirement after first WB-8 plasma last November. Reported delays have been said to be due to testing tracking funds, rather than the ideal situation of funds tracking experimentation schedule.
ah, so government bureaucracy is slowing everything down? surprise surprise.
Not quite. Not enough money is how I read that. Or if you were a pessimist, it is costing too much to test.
Not enough? They've barely used half their allotted funds so far according to the report.