US Condemns Bomb Attack on Iran Nuclear Scientist
US Condemns Bomb Attack on Iran Nuclear Scientist
HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!
Again the Israeli government committed a terrible crime against humanity.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-16501566
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-16519304
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
Happy New Year back. I do wish you and your family the best. I also expected you would pop up with this post or a comment on the attack.
This is a tragic event for the man and his family. However, I have to wonder why you so quickly assign guilt?
I would offer that there are many both inside Iran, and outside Iran that would have done this. What if it was the Saudi government or faction? What if it was a dissident group inside Iran?
I would say that non-Perisan access to Iran is probably limited in the aspect of ability to move freely, recruit, train, and sustain potential attackers over time, in that they could eventually meet target engagement criteria, and place the armed explosive.
My own thinking tends to believe it would be easier and more plausible for an Arab or Persian actor to organize this and pull it off (especially more than once).
Either way, I feel compassion for the deaths. I default to thinking the two men were decent people, and the deaths will bring sadness to their friends and families.
Keep your head down, I am also guessing there is more to come. Who ever is doing it is probably not done yet.
This is a tragic event for the man and his family. However, I have to wonder why you so quickly assign guilt?
I would offer that there are many both inside Iran, and outside Iran that would have done this. What if it was the Saudi government or faction? What if it was a dissident group inside Iran?
I would say that non-Perisan access to Iran is probably limited in the aspect of ability to move freely, recruit, train, and sustain potential attackers over time, in that they could eventually meet target engagement criteria, and place the armed explosive.
My own thinking tends to believe it would be easier and more plausible for an Arab or Persian actor to organize this and pull it off (especially more than once).
Either way, I feel compassion for the deaths. I default to thinking the two men were decent people, and the deaths will bring sadness to their friends and families.
Keep your head down, I am also guessing there is more to come. Who ever is doing it is probably not done yet.
Aslan,
A little early, aren't you? But in return for your nice seasonal greeting, I anticipate the arrival of spring, and wish you happy Nowruz in advance!
Previous statements by the Iranian government on the earlier similar attack was that this must be Israel or the US due to the sophistication of the attack. After all, it involved two people on a motor scooter and the bomb had a magnet to make it stick to the car.
This made me smile, in spite of the tragedy of it all. Essentially Iran was claiming that the technology of a large refrigerator magnet and operation of a scooter was beyond any common bomber.
Iran is not without internal dissent (PMOI for example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Mujahedin_of_Iran), and is also capable of staging its own bombings for its political ends. Furthermore, in the days of the Islamic Revolution, they did bomb opponents, ex-pats living in the US, in their cars.
I've never heard a scrap of proof that Israel was involved. I would expect if they were, the death would be of more subtle causes (and I do think they're capable of it). But if Israel did it, the death would be a key person without whom the project would be crippled.
But I condemn this act and others like it. As I condemn Iran attempting to build nuclear weapons, which they are, without question.
A little early, aren't you? But in return for your nice seasonal greeting, I anticipate the arrival of spring, and wish you happy Nowruz in advance!
Previous statements by the Iranian government on the earlier similar attack was that this must be Israel or the US due to the sophistication of the attack. After all, it involved two people on a motor scooter and the bomb had a magnet to make it stick to the car.
This made me smile, in spite of the tragedy of it all. Essentially Iran was claiming that the technology of a large refrigerator magnet and operation of a scooter was beyond any common bomber.
Iran is not without internal dissent (PMOI for example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Mujahedin_of_Iran), and is also capable of staging its own bombings for its political ends. Furthermore, in the days of the Islamic Revolution, they did bomb opponents, ex-pats living in the US, in their cars.
I've never heard a scrap of proof that Israel was involved. I would expect if they were, the death would be of more subtle causes (and I do think they're capable of it). But if Israel did it, the death would be a key person without whom the project would be crippled.
But I condemn this act and others like it. As I condemn Iran attempting to build nuclear weapons, which they are, without question.
Last edited by Tom Ligon on Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
Tom, actually be careful there. I am not saying that Israel has been involved, but the Mossad does not have a reputation of being subtle. They dont just eliminate the target, they also deliver a message with it.
Think of Gerald Bull, the inventor of the modern artillery cannon who as shot down on open street and he was just one of many that were shot or blown up by the Israeli secret service (whether justified or not, is not for debate here, it is about the MO).
Personally, I prefer them taking out the nuclear scientists over starting an open war which might kill a lot more. I am sure Aslan would agree with that too.
It is also possible that opposition forces inside Iran want to deliver a message to Israel and the US that to hold their horses and not start a war, because the resistance in Iran might take care of it internally.
Lots of possibilities. I would think that the US is less likely. It does not fit their MO. They would rather just send a few airstrikes and be done with it.
Think of Gerald Bull, the inventor of the modern artillery cannon who as shot down on open street and he was just one of many that were shot or blown up by the Israeli secret service (whether justified or not, is not for debate here, it is about the MO).
Personally, I prefer them taking out the nuclear scientists over starting an open war which might kill a lot more. I am sure Aslan would agree with that too.
It is also possible that opposition forces inside Iran want to deliver a message to Israel and the US that to hold their horses and not start a war, because the resistance in Iran might take care of it internally.
Lots of possibilities. I would think that the US is less likely. It does not fit their MO. They would rather just send a few airstrikes and be done with it.
Why would thier ability as a nuclear power be any worse than China, or Russia, or North Korea?Tom Ligon wrote:Aslan,
As I condemn Iran attempting to build nuclear weapons, which they are, without question.
How does one ethically stop them from building one? Only by diplomacy and persuasion. Iran, please build polywells not bombs.
Because the leadership of China and Russia has a better grasp on reality and sense of self preservation to not start a nuclear war. Even nutty North Korea would be slightly safer with the bomb, but I wouldn't trust them with it.bennmann wrote:Why would thier ability as a nuclear power be any worse than China, or Russia, or North Korea?
How does one ethically stop them from building one? Only by diplomacy and persuasion. Iran, please build polywells not bombs.
Bennmann asks, "Why would thier ability as a nuclear power be any worse than China, or Russia, or North Korea?"
Be complete, now. Add in the US, England, France, Israel ...
Good question, how does one ethically stop nuclear ambitions, especially when you are the only country on Earth to have used the #$%@ things in a war? One can debate the relative numbers of Japanese lives that would have been lost with continued conventional bombs and an eventual invasion, not to mention starvation, 'til the cows come home, but the bottom line is the US has no leg to stand on when it says no newcomers are welcome in the nuke club.
The US and Soviet Union got their lessons in nuclear brinksmanship the hard way, by building up insane arsenals and finally realizing the only thing keeping us from Mutual Destruction was the assurance that it was almost certainly assured, and the Russians loved their children too.
I have always thought that all prospective members of the nuclear club ought to visit Japan and have a nice talking to from the only people ever to be on the receiving end of a nuclear war.
Nuclear weapons may seem desirable. Israel certainly wanted them and has used them as a deterrent. But now Israel is faced with the knowledge that they are so small they could easily be effectively wiped out with two of the infernal things. India and Pakistan hopefully will take a deep breath and decide it ain't worth it. Iran and North Korea need to know that any use by them will result in instant annihilation of their own country. MAD seems the only real way to assure they are not used.
Be complete, now. Add in the US, England, France, Israel ...
Good question, how does one ethically stop nuclear ambitions, especially when you are the only country on Earth to have used the #$%@ things in a war? One can debate the relative numbers of Japanese lives that would have been lost with continued conventional bombs and an eventual invasion, not to mention starvation, 'til the cows come home, but the bottom line is the US has no leg to stand on when it says no newcomers are welcome in the nuke club.
The US and Soviet Union got their lessons in nuclear brinksmanship the hard way, by building up insane arsenals and finally realizing the only thing keeping us from Mutual Destruction was the assurance that it was almost certainly assured, and the Russians loved their children too.
I have always thought that all prospective members of the nuclear club ought to visit Japan and have a nice talking to from the only people ever to be on the receiving end of a nuclear war.
Nuclear weapons may seem desirable. Israel certainly wanted them and has used them as a deterrent. But now Israel is faced with the knowledge that they are so small they could easily be effectively wiped out with two of the infernal things. India and Pakistan hopefully will take a deep breath and decide it ain't worth it. Iran and North Korea need to know that any use by them will result in instant annihilation of their own country. MAD seems the only real way to assure they are not used.
RWB quote:
"Tom, nuclear weapons are addictive. Once you set one of them off, it makes you feel like a god, and you want to do it again."
And once you own them, you never want to give them up, even though they make you more at risk of total destruction than you ever were without them. Because once you have them, there will be no half measures against you. No enemy with comparable capacity will invade ... they will flatten you in one massive attack. So you feel powerful for owning them, but you cannot use them, and can't sleep at night for fear they paint a target on you.
"Tom, nuclear weapons are addictive. Once you set one of them off, it makes you feel like a god, and you want to do it again."
And once you own them, you never want to give them up, even though they make you more at risk of total destruction than you ever were without them. Because once you have them, there will be no half measures against you. No enemy with comparable capacity will invade ... they will flatten you in one massive attack. So you feel powerful for owning them, but you cannot use them, and can't sleep at night for fear they paint a target on you.
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Joseph Chikva
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In reality only USA and Soviet Union which assignee is Russia were on borderline of nuclear war. Now Russia and China transfer to Iran nuclear technologies. Now Iran without doubt is very aggressive. The creation of Israel state was a peaceful idea. But that time Israelis used terrorism methods against e.g. Britains.hanelyp wrote:Because the leadership of China and Russia has a better grasp on reality and sense of self preservation to not start a nuclear war. Even nutty North Korea would be slightly safer with the bomb, but I wouldn't trust them with it.bennmann wrote:Why would thier ability as a nuclear power be any worse than China, or Russia, or North Korea?
How does one ethically stop them from building one? Only by diplomacy and persuasion. Iran, please build polywells not bombs.
Also the question: why several countries have a right to have nuclear weapon and why others do not? Why it would not be better that all countries including USA deny nuke?
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Joseph Chikva
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- Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am
Wrong. Today's military weakness of Russia increases importance of remaining there nuclear weapon. Because nobody wants to lose the war. Similarly before development and wide usage of high-precision weapon in USA army there also was a doctrine on wide usage of nuclear charges even for tactical purpoces. Simply today US Army has a capability to solve the majority its tasks without usage of nuke while capabilities of other armies are much weaker.Tom Ligon wrote:The US and Soviet Union got their lessons in nuclear brinksmanship the hard way.
Japan and Germany on 24 hours notice. South Africa (past tense). 50-50 says Taiwan sub rosa.Tom Ligon wrote:Bennmann asks, "Why would their ability as a nuclear power be any worse than China, or Russia, or North Korea?"
Be complete, now. Add in the US, England, France, Israel ...
Nonproliferation has appeared deader than disco for the last 15 years - which makes the recent "energetic" 10th hour opposition to the Iranian Program so... odd.
Very simply.Tom Ligon wrote:Good question, how does one ethically stop nuclear ambitions, especially when you are the only country on Earth to have used the #$%@ things in a war?
"Because we say so."
But then you have to make it stick, and the will among the Bigs is no longer there.
"Rational interest" has very different meanings in different circumstances and cultures.Tom Ligon wrote:Nuclear weapons may seem desirable. Israel certainly wanted them and has used them as a deterrent. But now Israel is faced with the knowledge that they are so small they could easily be effectively wiped out with two of the infernal things. India and Pakistan hopefully will take a deep breath and decide it ain't worth it. Iran and North Korea need to know that any use by them will result in instant annihilation of their own country. MAD seems the only real way to assure they are not used.
Vae Victis
If you see these links, you can conclude that, Who organize the assassinations?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkZQiOlHBzg
www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbBVGxYve9A
www.presstv.ir/detail/159624.html
www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkZQiOlHBzg
www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbBVGxYve9A
www.presstv.ir/detail/159624.html
[(All of Western News Agencies)+(www.presstv.ir)]=Perfect Conclusion.
blame it on the mongols, who killed half the population of the iranian plateau, and completely destroyed Baghdad ending the islamic golden age.
what they did to Baghdad was akin to nukeing Athens in the time of Aristotles.
from then on, muslins got much more fundamentalist and abandoned science and reason.
just as a small example, Iran would only regain its 13th century population (most of which was killed by mongols), by the mid 20th century!!!!
what they did to Baghdad was akin to nukeing Athens in the time of Aristotles.
from then on, muslins got much more fundamentalist and abandoned science and reason.
just as a small example, Iran would only regain its 13th century population (most of which was killed by mongols), by the mid 20th century!!!!
In this case, I think he has it half right. Set one off in the desert or on a mountain or out at sea and WOW-give me more!!! But the US usage over Japan has left a pychological scar that has yet to heal.Tom Ligon wrote:RWB quote:
"Tom, nuclear weapons are addictive. Once you set one of them off, it makes you feel like a god, and you want to do it again."
Has it struck anyone that when we "Merkans" say that we don't want folks to have them, at least part of the reason is because we wouldn't wish that psychic shock on even our worst enemy?
"Because we say so"? Well, yes, but more "because you can have NO IDEA what it is like".
Last edited by KitemanSA on Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joseph Chikva
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- Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:30 am
It has no matter who organized murder. If I would be a script writer the following scenario would seem interesting to me: that poor man was informer of e.g. Israel. But he was killed by Iranian special services. And then switch on the propagation engine. And then each true Iranian patriot including you becomes a part of that engine. Not viable scenario?Aslan wrote:If you see these links, you can conclude that, Who organize the assassinations?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkZQiOlHBzg
www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbBVGxYve9A
www.presstv.ir/detail/159624.html