Mark Suppes talk @ Lift conference

[edmeserve]

http://videos.liftconference.com/video/ ... ear-fusion

[Robthebob]

this forum really should've gone on to help mark.

[Diogenes]

this forum really should've gone on to help mark.

I considered it, but my initial assessment of his efforts did not inspire any confidence. I am glad he has persevered, and I am glad that he is expanding awareness of the polywell effort, but I am still dubious about his ability to actually accomplish any real or beneficial research on the pollywell concept.


I would love to be wrong, but that's just what I currently see.

Years ago I had considered making the attempt to build an actual polywell device, but after checking the cost of some minimal material required, I concluded it would be at least a 100k to make even the barest minimal amateur effort, and I was planning to construct the vacuum chamber myself.

That Prometheus would start off with some very unrealistic assumptions and also pursue aspects which I considered almost pointless, (3D printing?) are a couple of the reasons I've never followed his efforts closely. I hope I have indeed underestimated him, and I wish him all the success.

[JoeP]

Actions are more effective than forum postings, which is why I think Mark stands a good chance of eventually getting a useful prototype running in the real world.

Also, the use of 3-D printing allows custom fabrication of parts right from computer based design applications. Invaluable, especially when you don't have a machine shop there for you, ready to fabricate something for you at the drop of a hat.

[Diogenes]

Actions are more effective than forum postings, which is why I think Mark stands a good chance of eventually getting a useful prototype running in the real world.

It is easy for people to carp, and I was reluctant to do it, but I said what I felt needed to be said. Had he presented a more encouraging first impression I would have likely sent him some money or something. (I did in fact send $750.00 to EMC2, and would have sent more but for indications that the government was going to jump in and fund them with several million, which it did. Now I wish I had my $750.00 back. )

Also, the use of 3-D printing allows custom fabrication of parts right from computer based design applications. Invaluable, especially when you don't have a machine shop there for you, ready to fabricate something for you at the drop of a hat.

I know what 3-D printing allows, but when I am building something, my first response is not "I need to build a 3-D printer to make making things easier." My initial response is I just need to build whatever parts I need with the means at my disposal.

Sure, 3-D printing might come in useful for inventing a series of things, but for making one-of parts that are not that complicated, it is a diversion of otherwise beneficial brainpower, money and effort.

The main component of any polywell device is going to be a suitable vacuum chamber. I don't see such a thing being printed. Same thing with the Mag-grid, or vacuum system, or High voltage power supplies, or electron guns, etc.

All I see that are likely printable are relatively trivial support components, such as feed-throughs, standoffs, and such. None of the really crucial components lends themselves to being printed, unless you have an extremely large printer with extremely advanced capabilities.

Again, I regard this diversion into 3-D printing as a side issue, and is indicative of a lack of seriousness from my perspective. With that being said, I will laud his efforts and applaud his successes, but I will be surprised if he actually does anything truly useful to advance an actual functioning polywell.


Another side issue was his construction of a fusor. For What? Many people have built these, and they don't serve any interest in advancing polywell. Just another side distraction in my opinion.

[krenshala]

I thought the idea behind him building a fusor first was to get a better handle on power supply and vacuum chamber operation before he started working on the polywell itself. From an incremental development standpoint it made sense to me.

[Aero]

I thought the idea behind him building a fusor first was to get a better handle on power supply and vacuum chamber operation before he started working on the polywell itself. From an incremental development standpoint it made sense to me.

That's what I thought as well.

Regarding 3-D printing, so what? It was an amateur effort and he was curious so he learned how to use them. Now, if there is a payoff, he is in position to reap that payoff. And we can't deny that he has advanced his Polywell construction skills and equipment far beyond what most of us have. Knowledge is usless until it is applied.

[Diogenes]

I thought the idea behind him building a fusor first was to get a better handle on power supply and vacuum chamber operation before he started working on the polywell itself. From an incremental development standpoint it made sense to me.

So no comment about the utility of a 3D printer in building a polywell?


Can you specify what can be learned from a fusor that might actually be useful for a polywell? I would suggest a polywell is an order of magnitude in greater difficulty.

I don't see anything being learned about the vacuum chamber of a fusor being applicable to the vacuum chamber of a polywell. I don't see anything in the fusor's power supply being useful in driving the large magnet array. About the only things that might be usable between the two devices are the electron guns and the gas emitters, and they aren't the DIFFICULT parts of the design.

When a man sets out to build a cannon, there is not much he can learn from building a pistol.

[Diogenes]

I thought the idea behind him building a fusor first was to get a better handle on power supply and vacuum chamber operation before he started working on the polywell itself. From an incremental development standpoint it made sense to me.

That's what I thought as well.

Regarding 3-D printing, so what? It was an amateur effort and he was curious so he learned how to use them. Now, if there is a payoff, he is in position to reap that payoff. And we can't deny that he has advanced his Polywell construction skills and equipment far beyond what most of us have. Knowledge is usless until it is applied.

I applaud his efforts, but to encourage others to contribute time or money, it works better if it doesn't look like you're pursuing amateurish ideas of little benefit to the ultimate goal.

The diversion into the 3D printing was a complete turnoff for me. Had he started with trying to get or construct a large vacuum chamber, How to degass it, how to obtain adequate vacuum pumping equipment and how to wind and cool large superconducting coils, etc. I would have followed his efforts with interest.

My point is, I didn't see EMC2 fooling with 3D printing, or trying to recreate the Fusor.

[krenshala]

Didn't Dr B start with an ETW fusor and build up from there for the Polywell?

[JoeP]

Dio, you are overly critical, IMO. Sure we would all like to see faster progress, because we all want Polywell to have successes.

I'm pretty sure Mark wanted 3-D design and printing to model the magrid components, as well as the other things you see in early posts in his blog. The guy is a software engineer and he designs on the computer. To quickly design something virtually and just upload or print a 3-D model that he can send off to get fabricated (which he has done) has value.

[Robthebob]

building the fusor is to test the environment that can later host the polywell.

The CTH group, the fusion group i worked under during my undergrad years, had similar power and vacuum system, just bigger. A small fusor is the closest to a small polywell in terms of power usage and environment, that was the reason.

He's building a polywell now tho, or had built a polywell.

[ladajo]

Haven't seen much work out of his lab for a while. Just a couple of road show presentations.

I have been wondering if Marc ran out of money again, and had to get a real job for a funding plus up.

[Diogenes]

Dio, you are overly critical, IMO. Sure we would all like to see faster progress, because we all want Polywell to have successes.

I do not wish to be overly critical. I am just trying to explain why I didn't feel the urge to help him with money, as I did EMC^2. Think of me as Simon Cowell on American Idol. I don't want to be critical, but it does no one any good to just tell them they are doing fine when they are not.

I'm pretty sure Mark wanted 3-D design and printing to model the magrid components, as well as the other things you see in early posts in his blog. The guy is a software engineer and he designs on the computer. To quickly design something virtually and just upload or print a 3-D model that he can send off to get fabricated (which he has done) has value.

I wish him all the success. His methods are different from my own, but they may yield a good result anyway.

[Diogenes]

Didn't Dr B start with an ETW fusor and build up from there for the Polywell?

I thought he started with the combined theories of Elmore Tuck and Watson, and worked out more theory from there.