EEStor says something - but not too much

Point out news stories, on the net or in mainstream media, related to polywell fusion.

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GIThruster
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby GIThruster » Tue Apr 07, 2015 3:07 pm

On to more important matters. . .krenshala, do the lakes in the Austin area ice over during winter or are they totally ice free?
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

krenshala
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Location: Austin, TX, NorAm, Sol III

Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby krenshala » Tue Apr 07, 2015 7:59 pm

GIThruster wrote:On to more important matters. . .krenshala, do the lakes in the Austin area ice over during winter or are they totally ice free?

What is this "winter" you speak of?

We got a bit of ice a few months ago, but I don't think any body of water stayed cold long enough for ice to form more than a tiny bit at the edges (and I don't remember seeing any). This was an unusually cold winter in my experience (moved here in late '99 from VA), the temperatures actually got low enough for ice to form on overpasses but nowhere else.

papapoe
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby papapoe » Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:36 pm

GIThruster wrote:Has there ever been a post in this thread worth the time to read? I can't remember a single one.

Hey GIThruster, I went back and read this whole thread. You attempted to spread a misinformation about AFRL and LM doing a study on EESCAM claims. You would fit right in at theestory.com site where they want people to believe they have "healthy debates" about EEScam, but in reality they peddle Dick Weir's fraud based on misinformation like your post? The AFRL emails I posted are worth your time to read unless you don't care for the facts and just want to peddle Dick Weir's fraud like the others over theestory.com who did for years. In case you forgot this is the misinformation you posted:

GIThruster wrote:I don't have time right now to do the search myself, but both the Air Force Research Lab at Edwards, and Lock-Mart have done studies on EESTore's claims. Lock-Mart is an investor and AFRL was interested for obvious reasons. Anyone who can get the results of those tests would do well to post them. In particular, the results of the testing at Edwards ought to be subject to FOI inquiry if nothing else.

GIThruster
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby GIThruster » Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:54 pm

papapoe wrote:You would fit right in at theestory.com site where they want people to believe they have "healthy debates" about EEScam, but in reality they peddle Dick Weir's fraud based on misinformation like your post?


I think you misunderstand. This is not worth my time. Is that clear? This is not an EEStor forum and I have no interest in those forums. You only post here about them, and I am just saying true, no one here thinks this is worth their time. We're AGREEING with you, that this is a farce.

What is your problem? Do you sell batteries for A123 or something?
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

papapoe
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby papapoe » Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:52 am

GIThruster wrote:
papapoe wrote:You would fit right in at theestory.com site where they want people to believe they have "healthy debates" about EEScam, but in reality they peddle Dick Weir's fraud based on misinformation like your post?

I think you misunderstand. This is not worth my time. Is that clear? This is not an EEStor forum and I have no interest in those forums. You only post here about them, and I am just saying true, no one here thinks this is worth their time. We're AGREEING with you, that this is a farce.
What is your problem? Do you sell batteries for A123 or something?

I have a problem with people like you who spread misinformation. That's how this EESCAM fraud story was and is kept alive. Why did you LIE about LM and AFRL testing EESUs when they never did? I posted proof with the AFRL emails and yesterday you post there was not a single post worth your time to read in this thread. Are you implying the AFRL emails were not worth your time to read? If you did read AFRL email you wouldn't have posted the following,
papapoe wrote:
GIThruster wrote:Has there ever been a post in this thread worth the time to read? I can't remember a single one.


BTW-I did not start this thread, but there are many threads on this board in which the topics have nothing to do with Polywell that are posted, do you complain about those threads? It's sounding to me you might have stock in The EESCAM Corp that is why you don't want any bad news posted in this thread because you don't want new investors to find out about Dick Weir documented scam. That's one of the reason theestory.ning.com was shut down.

GIThruster
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby GIThruster » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:32 pm

I don't have a problem with this thread existing. I have a problem when you tell me or anyone else that I lied and that if I weren't a liar, I'd read your posts. Your posts are not worth my time. I didn't lie. LockMart did have an agreement with EEStor, and they posted online that AFRL was going to test their caps. That never happened, and if I was not precise enough in my rather casual handling of a completely unimportant topic, oh well. I'm not gonna beat myself up about it.

You are however a very different story. You're deliberately venting your hatred here in the forum, on a topic either no one or almost no one cares about, and making blind accusations at people--at least me, I don't know how many others and I'm not going to waste my time reading back to find out-that are just example of how much a troll you are.

Guess what? We don't need any more trolls here. Guess what? We don't need any holy crusaders here, pretending they're saving us all from the dread evil EEStor, who wants to pick our pockets. Guess what? No one is gonna miss you when you amble off to antagonize, stir up trouble and otherwise prove yourself a troll somewhere else. No joke, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

pdxpyro
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby pdxpyro » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:56 pm

Hear, hear!

It took me a couple of his (assuming "his") posts to figure out that responding would be tantamount to troll-feeding.

I do (or did, anyway) have an interest in this saga, so have been following this thread. For the most part, though, I share GT's thoughtful sentiments below.
GIThruster wrote:I don't have a problem with this thread existing. I have a problem when you tell me or anyone else that I lied and that if I weren't a liar, I'd read your posts. Your posts are not worth my time. I didn't lie. LockMart did have an agreement with EEStor, and they posted online that AFRL was going to test their caps. That never happened, and if I was not precise enough in my rather casual handling of a completely unimportant topic, oh well. I'm not gonna beat myself up about it.

You are however a very different story. You're deliberately venting your hatred here in the forum, on a topic either no one or almost no one cares about, and making blind accusations at people--at least me, I don't know how many others and I'm not going to waste my time reading back to find out-that are just example of how much a troll you are.

Guess what? We don't need any more trolls here. Guess what? We don't need any holy crusaders here, pretending they're saving us all from the dread evil EEStor, who wants to pick our pockets. Guess what? No one is gonna miss you when you amble off to antagonize, stir up trouble and otherwise prove yourself a troll somewhere else. No joke, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

papapoe
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby papapoe » Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:14 pm

GIThruster wrote:I don't have a problem with this thread existing. I have a problem when you tell me or anyone else that I lied and that if I weren't a liar, I'd read your posts. Your posts are not worth my time. I didn't lie. LockMart did have an agreement with EEStor, and they posted online that AFRL was going to test their caps. That never happened, and if I was not precise enough in my rather casual handling of a completely unimportant topic, oh well. I'm not gonna beat myself up about it.

GIThruster, Keep on posting LIES, you are an outright liar. LM NEVER posted anything online AFRL was going to test their caps. When LM signed the agreement with EESCAM it wasn't caps con Dick Weir was peddling. It was a disruptive EESU that was going to power electric vehicles over 200 miles on one charge and put all lithium battery companies out of business. Now con Dick Weir is peddling he has a disruptive cap that is going to take over the capacitor industry.

You would fit right in with your lies at the new eescamstory site and have a nice circle jerk with the scammers there. They will love you.

papapoe
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby papapoe » Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:38 pm

pdxpyro wrote:Hear, hear!
It took me a couple of his (assuming "his") posts to figure out that responding would be tantamount to troll-feeding.
I do (or did, anyway) have an interest in this saga, so have been following this thread. For the most part, though, I share GT's thoughtful sentiments below.


pdxpyro, this is the new eestory sitehttp://edensity.ning.com/tbs-place where they are having "healthy debate" in aiding and abetting in Dick Weir's fraud.

papapoe
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby papapoe » Thu Apr 09, 2015 4:45 pm

This is for the people who like to spread lies in the EEScam fraud story. Lockheed Martin NEVER posted anything online AFRL was going to test the EESUs or craps, lol.

PRESS RELEASE from January 9, 2008

Lockheed Martin Signs Agreement with EESTOR for Energy Storage Solutions
Released on Wednesday, January 9, 2008
EEStor
Lockheed Martin
CEO - Chief Executive Officer
EESU - Electrical Energy Storage Unit
DALLAS, TX, January 9th, 2008 -- Lockheed Martin [NYSE: LMT] has signed an exclusive international rights agreement to integrate and market Electrical Energy Storage Units (EESU) from EEStor, Inc., for military and homeland security applications. Specific terms of the agreement were not disclosed.
EEStor, based in Cedar Park, TX, is developing a ceramic battery chemistry that could provide 10 times the energy density of lead acid batteries at 1/10th the weight and volume. As envisioned, EESUs will be a fully "green" technology that will be half the price per stored watt-hour than traditional battery technologies.
"Lockheed Martin has a wide range of innovative energy solutions for federal, state and regional energy applications," said Glenn Miller, vice president of Technical Operations and Applied Research at Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control. "The EEStor energy storage technology provides potential solutions for the demanding requirements for energy in military and homeland defense applications."
EESUs are planned as nontoxic, non-hazardous and non-explosive. Since the EESU design is based on ultra-capacitor architecture, it will allow for flexible packaging and rapid charge/discharge capabilities. EESUs will be ideally suited for a wide range of power management initiatives that could lead to energy independence for the Warfighter.
"Lockheed Martin continues to focus on providing our Warfighters with new and innovative technologies that will make their jobs easier," said Lionel Liebman, manager of Program Development - Applied Research at Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control. "Our ruggedized BattPack™ energy storage unit generated considerable interest at the Association of the United States Army Annual Meeting in October 2007 for its potential for fuel savings in vehicular silent watch applications. The potential of an even safer, smaller and more powerful EESU in BattPack™ would significantly enhance the Warfighter's capabilities."
EESU qualification testing and mass production at EEStor's facility in Cedar Park is planned for late 2008.
EEStor, Inc., of Cedar Park, TX, originally developed its solid-state EESU technology as a longer lasting, lighter, more powerful environmentally friendly electronic storage unit for a wide variety of applications. EEStor's vision also includes EESU facilitating the conversion of wind energy and photovoltaics into primary electrical energy providers and increasing the role of renewables for increasing energy production. Its CEO and president, Richard Weir, is also the inventor named on its EESU principal technology patent."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you are a fan of Dick Weir's BS, listen to the 2nd part of the AGM, I'm sure you'll be happy hearing from him, lol.

2015 Zenn AGM Part 1
2015 Zenn AGM Part 2
Part 1 Ian Clifford gives his presentation, Q&A
Part 2 Q&A continued, Dick Weir answers questions, yes DW was at AGM.

raelik
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby raelik » Fri Apr 10, 2015 6:40 pm

papapoe wrote:GIThruster, Keep on posting LIES, you are an outright liar. LM NEVER posted anything online AFRL was going to test their caps. When LM signed the agreement with EESCAM it wasn't caps con Dick Weir was peddling. It was a disruptive EESU that was going to power electric vehicles over 200 miles on one charge and put all lithium battery companies out of business. Now con Dick Weir is peddling he has a disruptive cap that is going to take over the capacitor industry.

You would fit right in with your lies at the new eescamstory site and have a nice circle jerk with the scammers there. They will love you.


papapoe wrote:This is for the people who like to spread lies in the EEScam fraud story. Lockheed Martin NEVER posted anything online AFRL was going to test the EESUs or craps, lol.


Is there something wrong with you? So maybe he inferred that they did, and in actuality they didn't and he's just, I dunno, mistaken and not actually a liar. Do you see the problem with your accusations? Nobody HERE (I hope) believes anything is ever coming out of EEStor except vapor. Why are you arguing semantics about it and accusing people of lies (people that actually agree with you that it's a total scam) on a thread that was dead for 4 months on a site that has nothing to do with it? You've let this thing get so far up your ass you can't see straight anymore. Pull it out, take a deep breath, and let it go. Seriously, before you have a stroke or something.

Asterix
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby Asterix » Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:54 pm

For whatever it's worth, B has declared the game's end. Too bad--it made for some entertainment.

GIThruster
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby GIThruster » Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:57 pm

The PS at the end is funny!

I should note that I do not personally flinch when I see 8 years of effort as if there is some sort of test one could have that requires best results in any time frame. BLP and Millis have been at it for about 3X as long. The fact people grow weary over years says something important about people, but nothing about the viability of a technology, and B's own account is that he still thinks there's something there. He's just too worn out to stick with the thing as it develops--or not. And who can blame him? LockMart and Perkins both seem to have bailed.

Does any of this, even the stories of the deceptions wrought, come to the issue of whether they have the makings of a viable technology? Not really.

So is this the end of the story? I've no idea.

I have not followed this story and when I hear the stories of the deceptions, I have even less interest. Given this though, I think it is just being fair to say that the story appears to me to be a disconnect between what is theoretically possible, and what can be manufactured. If this is true, we may yet see it manufactured. Who knows? And I'd note that barium titanate is hardly the highest k perovskite available. Were one to start this sort of discovery today and try to put single nano-crystals between two plates at such purity that no dopants would short them; one would likely not choose BaTiO3. So the question remains whether one can actually plate nano-crystals and use them in a commercial product.

I think? Isn't this the question? It is after all true, that single crystal BaTiO3 has a k of about 5,000, but the Japanese and Tecdia have these ALTAS caps with effective k's over 30,000, so the basic premise is not all wrong and others have taken it to some practical applications.

My take away is just that no matter how promising a seeming technology, one needs to be able to manufacture what they propose and EEStor has never been able to do this. Isn't this the issue?
"Courage is not just a virtue, but the form of every virtue at the testing point." C. S. Lewis

Asterix
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby Asterix » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:37 am

So is this the end of the story? I've no idea.


Heck, there are still believers in John Keeley, Bessler and Joe Papp. There never is an end for some people. Rational people, on the other hand, move on with life.

Now, is there any physical law that prohibits densely storing a large charge in a capacitor instead of as a chemical reaction? I'm not aware of one. All you need is a lot of surface area and a very strong dielectric. Did Weir have one such device? Most likely not; at least nothing much better than current state of the art. I don't think that Zenn can survive, but will slowly circle the drain over the next year.

One thing that stopped me from sinking any money in the venture, other than the technical issues ("Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?") was Zenn's (as "Feel Good Cars"), penchant for boneheaded stupidity. Look up "Feel Good Cars" and "Alternate Energy Corporation". Back in 2004, they teamed up with a guy who had a system for using an ICE running from hydrogen produced by immersing a metal alloy in water, then reclaiming the water from the exhaust. The idea is that the alloy would be slowly consumed over a 90-day period; and little or no additional water would be needed. If you were stupid drunk, it sounded like a good idea. The same Ian Clifford was running the company then.

Capacitor technology has come a long way over the last 50 years. There may be hope for it yet as a competitive power storage technology. Just not from a company like Zenn.

mvanwink5
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Re: EEStor says something - but not too much

Postby mvanwink5 » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:32 am

Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?
These days reducing idiocy to absurdity is a redundancy lost on many, but I appreciated the quote immensely.

At one point very early on I thought there was something to the claims, but inconsistencies in the key patent revealed measurement claims included in the patent were bogus, fabrications, and finished my trust in forthrightness of the principals. Ever since that point the behavior of the companies, claims of the need for secrecy, never any hardware, 'no need for prototypes, go right for the production line,' all the 'connect the dots' reasoning, all was consistent with pulling the wool.

So other than that...
Near term, cheap, dark horse fusion hits the air waves, GF - TED, LM - Announcement. The race is on.


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