New Fusion Fuel Possibility - Ultradense Deuterium

djolds1 · Post by **djolds1** » Tue May 12, 2009 3:32 am

http://nextbigfuture.com/2009/05/univer ... aking.html

University of Gothenberg Making Microscopic Quantities of Ultradense Deuterium: 130,000 Times Denser than Water

A material that is a hundred thousand times heavier than water and more dense than the core of the Sun is being produced at the University of Gothenburg. The scientists working with this material are aiming for an energy process that is both more sustainable and less damaging to the environment than the nuclear power used today. Ultra-dense deuterium may be a very efficient fuel in laser driven nuclear fusion. Ultra-dense deuterium is a million times more dense than frozen deuterium, making it relatively easy to create a nuclear fusion reaction using high-power pulses of laser light. “If we can produce large quantities of ultra-dense deuterium, the fusion process may become the energy source of the future. And it may become available much earlier than we have thought possible”, says Leif Holmlid. "Further, we believe that we can design the deuterium fusion such that it produces only helium and hydrogen as its products, both of which are completely non-hazardous. It will not be necessary to deal with the highly radioactive tritium that is planned for use in other types of future fusion reactors, and this means that laser-driven nuclear fusion as we envisage it will be both more sustainable and less damaging to the environment than other methods that are being developed.”

icarus · Post by **icarus** » Tue May 12, 2009 3:54 am

We only need some one to chime in that this new Rydberg state of "ultra-dense deuterium" is what cold fusion achieves in the palladium lattice and the whack factor will hit 99.5%.

chrismb · Post by **chrismb** » Tue May 12, 2009 6:07 am

Already noted in viewtopic.php?t=1252

Art Carlson · Post by **Art Carlson** » Tue May 12, 2009 7:39 am

icarus wrote:... the whack factor will hit 99.5%.

It sure dings my bell.

I should have the good sense to just ignore this, but let me ask anyway. Is there any reputable literature on a "D(-1)" state (hydrinos, anyone?) or "inverted metals", or are these guys making everything up?

ohiovr · Post by **ohiovr** » Tue May 12, 2009 12:35 pm

So how did they achieve that??

Solo · Post by **Solo** » Tue May 12, 2009 2:06 pm

This sounds pretty sketchy. If you look at the abstract to this paper

abstract wrote:The energy release of 630 ± 30 eV corresponds to an interatomic distance D–D of 2.3 ± 0.1 pm. This material is probably an inverted metal with the deuterons moving in the field from the stationary electrons, which gives a predicted interatomic distance of 2.5 pm, close to the measured value.

If he hits the stuff with a laser, how does he know that's not where the energy came from? And why on earth would you postulate that nuclei are orbiting electrons? That doesn't seem possible, and if it were I still don't see how it would reduce the bond length. (Well, maybe it would, maybe the energy states of an atom with a very heavy orbiting particle would be much smaller. But that's still a heck of a stretch.) I'm really surprized that got published, even if it's only in a spectroscopy journal.

They'd really need to show some other kind of evidence that the interatomic distance really was that size before I'd believe it. And they'd need to put it in a more appropriate journal. It sounds to me very similar to Black Light Power and their crazy "hydrinos": both claim to reduce the size of the hydrogen atom by some suspicious physics.

Art Carlson · Post by **Art Carlson** » Tue May 12, 2009 3:08 pm

Solo wrote:If he hits the stuff with a laser, how does he know that's not where the energy came from? And why on earth would you postulate that nuclei are orbiting electrons?

Without having wasted the time to actually read the paper, my guess is this. They have a nano-particle with maybe some thousands of atoms. They hit it with a laser and blast the electrons away, so they have a collection of naked nuclei in close proximity. The ions don't like that and shoot away with the energy gained by the Coulomb repulsion. The experimentalists measure this energy, which comes from the interaction of each ion with many others, and interpret it as the interaction of an ion with just one other. This would imply a small inter-ion distance. To dress this up in a theoretical garb, they connect this energy to the binding energy of an atom if the electron mass is replaced with the proton mass. I further guess that D(-1) is inspired by, and makes an equivalent amount of sense as, the hydrino, and that the postulated suppression of the strong force channels (those that produce T and He3 instead of alphas) is taken purely from cold fusion, without any basis in either their experiment or their theory.

chrismb · Post by **chrismb** » Tue May 12, 2009 3:15 pm

At a distance of 2.3pm, I would be expecting this stuff to already be fusing, in dense matter. If they can create this substance for long enough to some how compress it further, then they just need to sit back and monitor the neutrons, for now.... (not on an enery-payback basis, but I think some fusion should be occurring, muon-catalysed-style)

Solo · Post by **Solo** » Tue May 12, 2009 11:39 pm

Ahh, thanks Art, ignoring the collective energy would do the trick I suppose. That's a pretty elementary mistake, though. I rather doubt they did it on purpose... he *is* at a university after all.

TallDave · Post by **TallDave** » Sat May 23, 2009 11:28 pm

Is there any reputable literature on a "D(-1)" state (hydrinos, anyone?)

GRLCowan · Post by **GRLCowan** » Wed May 27, 2009 7:57 pm

Art Carlson wrote:
Solo wrote:If he hits the stuff with a laser, how does he know that's not where the energy came from? And why on earth would you postulate that nuclei are orbiting electrons?
Without having wasted the time to actually read the paper, my guess is this. They have a nano-particle with maybe some thousands of atoms. They hit it with a laser and blast the electrons away, so they have a collection of naked nuclei in close proximity. The ions don't like that and shoot away with the energy gained by the Coulomb repulsion.

So the energy is from the laser ...

Art Carlson wrote:The experimentalists measure this energy, which comes from the interaction of each ion with many others, and interpret it as the interaction of an ion with just one other. This would imply a small inter-ion distance.

Reading one of the two recent papers might not be a complete waste of time. The claim of tritium freedom isn't in either of them, just in a remark by Holmlid.

One of the papers was recently available at http://www.fusor.net/board/getfile.php? ... tt_id=5634 , and says,

It is not necessary to ionize the cluster or molecule by completely removing the electrons. Instead, it is sufficient to excite one or two electrons into higher orbitals in another part of the cluster, so that they temporarily do not shield the ions from each other. In a condensed phase with metallic properties, the electrons are delocalized in the ground state, i.e. they can move over a large part of the cluster. This is similar to the case of molecular orbitals in molecules with alternating bonds or aromatic rings. In this state, the electrons take part in the total shielding of the ions, giving a balancing of forces so that the cluster or molecule can exist. However, when electrons are excited and go into orbitals at higher energy, they become more localized and the effective shielding between ionic charges can be strongly decreased in some places in the cluster or molecule. This is the initial step of the CE process.

(How fire can be domesticated)