Nuclear Reactors Hit By Earthquake In Japan

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ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Thu Mar 31, 2011 2:24 am

Yes, the scale does not address release levels. It actually seems fairly vague in intent when you read it.

For example, nobody poured water over the slagged core in the Rx vessel at TMI-2 and then overflowed it via the containment into the surrounding environment. If that were the case, then I am sure the numerous times I drove by the site while visiting family in Hersey and Harrisburg would not have been possible.

"The TMI-2 Memorial Picnic Area".

rjaypeters
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Postby rjaypeters » Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:02 pm

Skipjack wrote:They still have not sent in any darn robots yet?

From The Slate: Fukushima's Bio-Robots
In Japan's nuclear cleanup, is human life cheaper than machines?
By William Saletan

http://www.slate.com/id/2290932/

Relevant quote: "A month into Japan's nuclear crisis, no robots have been put to work at the Fukushima Daiichi power plant. Instead, the plant's operator is relying on a cheaper, expendable resource: humans."

It's not really relevant to the Japanese situation, but read down to the bottom of the linked page to find what some people called humans during the Chernobyl clean-up.
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence

R. Peters

Giorgio
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Postby Giorgio » Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:45 pm

rjaypeters wrote:
Skipjack wrote:They still have not sent in any darn robots yet?

From The Slate: Fukushima's Bio-Robots
In Japan's nuclear cleanup, is human life cheaper than machines?
By William Saletan

http://www.slate.com/id/2290932/

Relevant quote: "A month into Japan's nuclear crisis, no robots have been put to work at the Fukushima Daiichi power plant. Instead, the plant's operator is relying on a cheaper, expendable resource: humans."

It's not really relevant to the Japanese situation, but read down to the bottom of the linked page to find what some people called humans during the Chernobyl clean-up.


No robot has yet the flexibility nor the ability to simultaneously handle all the different type of tasks that are required in such a clean up work.

Unfortunately when the situation is not linear Humans are still the best solution we have for now.

rjaypeters
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Location: Summerville SC, USA

Postby rjaypeters » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:02 pm

I am enjoying the intersection of this thread with "Rise of the Machines".
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence

R. Peters

ladajo
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Location: North East Coast

Postby ladajo » Mon Apr 11, 2011 7:16 pm

They are using "robots" in the sense of remotely operated equipment.

Giorgio
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Postby Giorgio » Mon Apr 11, 2011 7:24 pm

Yes, I am referring to those too.

rjaypeters
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Postby rjaypeters » Mon Apr 11, 2011 7:31 pm

Perhaps when you write "robot" you mean "remotely operated equipment." Doesn't matter really. The point is money.

The U.S. military funds experiments into "real" robotics challenges for autonomous land navigation, cooperative warfare, etc.

Have there been any equivalent challenges for reactor clean-up?
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence

R. Peters

ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:01 pm

Dude with a sponge seems to work well. For a cooperative mode, you have dudes with sponges.
Time/Distance/Shielding

:D

Giorgio
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Location: China, Italy

Postby Giorgio » Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:48 am

rjaypeters wrote:Have there been any equivalent challenges for reactor clean-up?


None that I am aware of.

MSimon
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Postby MSimon » Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:00 am

rjaypeters wrote:
Skipjack wrote:They still have not sent in any darn robots yet?

From The Slate: Fukushima's Bio-Robots
In Japan's nuclear cleanup, is human life cheaper than machines?
By William Saletan

http://www.slate.com/id/2290932/

Relevant quote: "A month into Japan's nuclear crisis, no robots have been put to work at the Fukushima Daiichi power plant. Instead, the plant's operator is relying on a cheaper, expendable resource: humans."

It's not really relevant to the Japanese situation, but read down to the bottom of the linked page to find what some people called humans during the Chernobyl clean-up.


I have a better article on biorobots.

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/201 ... japan.html

Also I have seen reports that Japan is having difficulty getting jumpers. The jumpers are willing to take 10 REM (double US allowance) but they need jumpers willing to take 25 REM to get significant work done.

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/201 ... uired.html

Look at the first link in this post to see how bad it is:

http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/201 ... april.html
Engineering is the art of making what you want from what you can get at a profit.

ladajo
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Location: North East Coast

Postby ladajo » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:53 pm

The SL-1 cleanup in Idaho had one visit stay times of seconds for some tasks.
Like, run in set the sponge and bucket on the table, run out. You are done, go home.
then, next dude;
Run in, grab the sponge for a wipe, then run out...

choff
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Postby choff » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:51 am

Maybe they should be asking death row inmates to work on the cleanup in return for a pardon.
CHoff

ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:09 am

Yeah, but what a crappy way to check out. I don't think they would buy it. Interesting thought though, provokes many civil liberties type arguments in my head.
Terminal Prisoners for Terminal Work. Hmmm.

Giorgio
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Location: China, Italy

Postby Giorgio » Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:21 am

One that comes to my mind is if the relatives of the victims should be involved in the prisoners decision.

ladajo
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Postby ladajo » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:32 pm

That is a hard one my friend. I guess as much as I would like to fall on the victims choose the punishment side of the argument, my civilized sense says that takes the blind out of justice.


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