Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

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Diogenes
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Diogenes » Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:17 am

Image
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

williatw
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby williatw » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:26 pm

Diogenes wrote:Image



From your link:



It fascinates me when people say, “Why won’t gun owners compromise?” by r3druger


We are told we are not allowed to own machine guns. We agreed.

We are told we are not allowed to carry Into government buildings. We agree.

We are told we are not allowed to carry in certain national parks. We agree.

We are told we are not allowed to defend ourselves on college campuses, despite after time and time again being slaughtered on supposedly “gun-free” areas, but we agreed.

We are told in the 90s we are not allowed to own (inappropriately labeled and completely undefinable) “assault weapons,” but it passed as we had to suck it up for 10 years.

We are told that we are DENIED the right to walk the streets of the most crime ridden cities without means of protecting ourselves, and once again we are left with little say.

Here’s my question, where is YOUR compromise?




Let me throw a document into the equation: The Constitution. Yeah, yeah, old news. You’ve heard it a million times.

Well, when the Constitution says “bear arms,” during the period in which it was signed, it meant bear any kind of weapon. Civilians owned the cannons, not the government.

Every man had a rifle. His own. It was either a family heirloom or a tool used to ensure survival. No one dared take a man’s livelihood.

What’s the difference today? Well, most people don’t own cannons. Civies don’t own tanks, helicopters, stealth fighters, or cruise missiles. So what are we left with? Rifles, pistols, in rare cases grenade launchers (which launch non-explosive rounds) and basically the equivalent to pea shooters against a tank.

Seems like a compromise.

We’re not allowed to own anything, because after all, why would any peaceful citizen need one right?

Wrong.

The reason the Second Amendment was the second, and not the tenth, or the fifth, or what have you, is because without it, no other right is guaranteed. Governments, regardless of country or creed takes any measures necessary to further to own authority. It is a promise of history.

What are we, as citizens, left with to defend ourselves with? Literally, pea shooters.

We are told we are not allowed to own machine guns. We agreed.

We are told we are not allowed to carry Into government buildings. We agree.

We are told we are not allowed to carry in certain national parks. We agree.

We are told we are not allowed to defend ourselves on college campuses, despite after time and time again being slaughtered on supposedly “gun-free” areas, but we agreed.

We are told in the 90s we are not allowed to own (inappropriately labeled and completely undefinable) “assault weapons,” but it passed as we had to suck it up for 10 years.

We are told that we are DENIED the right to walk the streets of the most crime ridden cities without means of protecting ourselves, and once again we are left with little say.

Here’s my question, where is YOUR compromise?

I’m not asking you to actually limit your constitutional rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

So far WE as gun owners are the ONLY ones doing any kind of compromising.

We’re not forcing anyone to do anything. We’re not holding lawmakers at gun point. However, lawmakers are literally holding gun owners at gunpoint to follow the law.

Yes. The government enforces laws. With police. And police carry guns.

We just want to be left alone. We’re not breaking the law. However we make compromise after compromise which limits are pushed every time a gun law passes.

I don’t see you having to compromise a darn thing. Oh, you’re scared because law abiding citizens carry? Boo hoo. But why are you afraid of people who wish you no harm? Why aren’t you instead afraid of criminals who *ahem* are criminals. And don’t follow the law anyway? You think because you pass a gun law he’ll magically turn in his gun out of guilt or civic duty? You can’t be serious.

Because real American gun owners don’t pose a threat to you.

You pose a threat to your own darn rights by chipping away at ours. Rights are equal amongst citizens of this country. When you start pretending you can limit ours, you’re really limiting your own as well. Some great compromising you’ve done.



http://americandigest.org/wp/fascinates ... #more-2409

Diogenes
Posts: 6819
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm
Location: Ft. Sill Oklahoma

Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Diogenes » Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:11 pm

williatw wrote:

From your link:






I thought you might like that one. :)


The guy that writes that blog is sorta amazing. He grew up as a Berkley Liberal, and he's had a very interesting career. He was actually an editor at "OMNI" magazine at one point in his career, and he also had the last photographs of John Lennon taken before his death.

He writes poetry, and he also writes excellent prose. He comes up with some very entertaining points from time to time. Here is another thing that I first saw on his website.


Image
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

Diogenes
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Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm
Location: Ft. Sill Oklahoma

Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Diogenes » Fri Sep 01, 2017 6:57 pm

I'm not really keen on the idea of removing Jackson from the $20.00 bill for several reasons, primarily among them the fact that he pisses off all the right people, but I am coming around to this idea, and for the same reason; It pisses off all the right people.


Image



https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/274386/#respond
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

Diogenes
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Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm
Location: Ft. Sill Oklahoma

Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Diogenes » Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:09 pm

Black Chicagoans Ignore Dem Leaders, Pull Epic Conservative Move

Despite Democrat leadership in the crime-ridden city imploring citizens to let law enforcement handle the exploding crime, residents — primarily black women — are thinking for themselves and buying guns for self defense.

The Chicago Tribune reported that nearly 1,400 black women in Illinois have received concealed carry permits in 2017. That number has gone up since last year and is almost twice the 800 who did so in 2014. More than 4,000 black women currently have a concealed carry permit in Cook County alone, where Chicago is located.





https://conservativetribune.com/black-i ... 2017-09-20


Let Freedom ring.
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

Diogenes
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Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:33 pm
Location: Ft. Sill Oklahoma

Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Diogenes » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:37 pm

Pictured: The two heroic locals who shot Texas gunman outside the church, chased him in their truck at 95mph and ran him off the road before he killed himself


ImageImage



A local resident told DailyMail.com that Willeford, who attends a different church, was first alerted to the shooting when his daughter called him saying there was a man in body armor gunning down church goers during mass.

He grabbed his gun and headed down to confront the gunman.


Willeford, a local plumber with no military experience, is however an excellent shot according to the resident, and when he came face to face with Kelley, he shot in between his body armor, hitting him in his side.




http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... =applenews
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

williatw
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Location: Ohio

Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby williatw » Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:46 pm

Diogenes wrote:Pictured: The two heroic locals who shot Texas gunman outside the church, chased him in their truck at 95mph and ran him off the road before he killed himself



Thanks for posting the link...I had heard something about the shooter being engaged by an armed citizen but the details I read were sketchy. From your link it says he was shot "between his body armor"; good shooting! Probably why he eventually lost control of his vehicle and crashed.

Found this:

Texas lets each church decide whether to allow permitted concealed handguns, and we don’t know whether this particular church allowed it.


http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/11/ ... h-gun.html

From an op-ed by John Lott, he usually has reliable info about incidences such as this; wouldn't be surprised if this churches' policy was "gun free"'; mass public shootings usually happen in gun free zones for obvious reasons.

Diogenes
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Diogenes » Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:41 am

williatw wrote:
Diogenes wrote:Pictured: The two heroic locals who shot Texas gunman outside the church, chased him in their truck at 95mph and ran him off the road before he killed himself



Thanks for posting the link...I had heard something about the shooter being engaged by an armed citizen but the details I read were sketchy. From your link it says he was shot "between his body armor"; good shooting! Probably why he eventually lost control of his vehicle and crashed.



That is exactly what I was thinking. It also occurred to me that if the citizen was using something like a .30-06, he could just shoot through the armor. Most body armor can't stop a .30-06 round.



williatw wrote:Found this:

Texas lets each church decide whether to allow permitted concealed handguns, and we don’t know whether this particular church allowed it.


http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/11/ ... h-gun.html

From an op-ed by John Lott, he usually has reliable info about incidences such as this; wouldn't be surprised if this churches' policy was "gun free"'; mass public shootings usually happen in gun free zones for obvious reasons.


I'm betting that a lot of churches in Texas are going to start having armed pastors or deacons, or at least some firearms in reserve somewhere in the church. I've read accounts of terrorist style attacks from experts, and they say that the mere fact of a confrontation with another shooter will usually cause someone to drop their original plan and try to flee.

When they encounter return fire in a case where they weren't expecting it, it unnerves them, and their mental discipline often crashes.
‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
— Lord Melbourne —

paperburn1
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby paperburn1 » Tue Nov 07, 2017 3:27 pm

I know that one mega church in Texas has armed ushers and their own police force license.
I am not a nuclear physicist, but play one on the internet.

Tom Ligon
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Tom Ligon » Tue Nov 07, 2017 10:04 pm

Turns out this latest jackarse was put into a mental institution in 2012, and escaped. To quote the Washington Post:

The gunman who opened fire in a church outside San Antonio, killing at least 26 people, escaped from a mental health facility in 2012 after he was caught sneaking guns onto an Air Force base and “attempting to carry out death threats” made against military superiors, according to a police report.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/pos ... d4935805fc

There are already laws on the books for his case ... what will it take to get compliance with them? I expect the Air Force will have a mad scramble to review cases ... one wonders how many others have been ignored. The Virginia Tech shooter was also known to be nuts, but his shrink had never reported it so he was able to buy firearms.

I await some background on his mental capacity. Judging from a photograph is not a great way of determining intelligence, but in the absence of more definitive information, his photo looks like his brain was about the size of a Lima bean.

SheltonJ
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby SheltonJ » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:49 am

Minor update on the Texas church shooting.
The gunman was armed with an AR-15 type rifle. The media referred to it as an assault weapon.
The civilian who stopped him was also armed with an AR-15 type rifle. The media referred to it as a gun or rifle if they mentioned it at all.
The civilian who stopped him is an NRA member and NRA instructor. Some elements of the media tried to blame the NRA for the shooting.
The Air Force failed to update the background check databases with the multiple disqualifying elements of the shooters background. Existing laws properly enforced would have prevented him from purchasing his guns. Ted Cruz proposed a bill to force the Government (including the military) to do exactly this reporting, some time back. The democrats filibustered it.

At the end of the chase, the shooter killed himself with a pistol - following the typical confronted coward pattern we have seen before.
Later the police showed up.

hanelyp
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby hanelyp » Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:38 pm

In other words, yet another mass shooting that doesn't fit the gun grabber's Narrative that we'd be better off with more laws that would end up disarming good citizens.
The daylight is uncomfortably bright for eyes so long in the dark.

Betruger
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Re: Crime and Punishment: Oklahoma (& Texas) style!

Postby Betruger » Fri Nov 24, 2017 1:10 am

For better or worse the US is past the point of no return for firearms. It is a force multiplier, whether or not it's an equalizer, and the US will pay the price for any firearmed-manifestation of its cultural ills. Cause like all other human clans, above all else the USA lives and dies by its culture.

I haven't been around as some of you guys, but to me the US seems to be dysfunctional, easily more than it's ever been.
You can do anything you want with laws except make Americans obey them. | What I want to do is to look up S. . . . I call him the Schadenfreudean Man.


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