How is instinct transmitted?

[Tom Ligon]

I've seen a speculation that there was a marked shift in human cognitive ability just before the Golden Age of the Greeks. The speculation is that, prior to that time, humans were a bunch of dimwits. Use of language is one of the arguments.

I suspect the use of language has more to do with style, but it is hard to prove this late in the game.

As far as any marked shifts in intelligence go, I'd put my money on having either leisure or incentive to let intelligence shine. Humans seem to me to have historically been at their inventive best during war. They've been at their artistic best in times of plenty. The apparent punctuation in our development more likely is environmental than evolutionary. However, it is certainly true that a prosperous society that can afford to support maji is conducive to allowing their genes to multiply. In the earliest days of agriculture, a strong back and a weak mind may have been the best mate a girl could hope for. Once kingdoms evolved, likely brains started to matter more.

[djolds1]

The author Jerry Pournelle posted an article about Ashkenazi cognitive overclocking on his website over a decade ago. IIRC, the math worked out that to get the +15% consistently and stably seen in Ashkenazim IQ testing over the last 120 years would take 40 generations of Mendelian trait amplification; i.e. 1000 years.

I'd ask Jerry to comment on this but he's in the hospital at the moment, and we're hoping he recovers quickly. The guy's had a rough last few years, but keeps on ticking like the EverReady bunny.

Found it:

http://www.jerrypournelle.com/archives2 ... tml#smarts

+12% when iterated over 40 generations, not +15%.

"Only the Ashkenazi had low gene flow and a preponderance of occupations with high IQ elasticity for hundreds of years. That is enough to have caused the IQ increase that we observe. The narrow-sense heritability of IQ is at least 0.3 - that means if the parents of the next generation average 1 point above the current population average, the next generation (with equal environments) will average 0.3 point higher. Continue this process for 40 generations and you get an increase of 12 points, just about what we see today."

I've seen a speculation that there was a marked shift in human cognitive ability just before the Golden Age of the Greeks. The speculation is that, prior to that time, humans were a bunch of dimwits. Use of language is one of the arguments.

I suspect the use of language has more to do with style, but it is hard to prove this late in the game.

I think that was about 50kya. A sudden shift in the complexity of abstract symbolic artifacts being used as a proxy for language. Then of course there's the lactose tolerance adaptation about 10kya.

As far as any marked shifts in intelligence go, I'd put my money on having either leisure or incentive to let intelligence shine. Humans seem to me to have historically been at their inventive best during war. They've been at their artistic best in times of plenty. The apparent punctuation in our development more likely is environmental than evolutionary. However, it is certainly true that a prosperous society that can afford to support maji is conducive to allowing their genes to multiply. In the earliest days of agriculture, a strong back and a weak mind may have been the best mate a girl could hope for. Once kingdoms evolved, likely brains started to matter more.

Human traits usually stick close to the central tendency. Generation 1 are soldiers, generation 2 are traders, generation 3 are farmers, and generation 4 is back to war. Traits are not significantly amplified because of the consistent shifting around.

[Tom Ligon]

Human traits usually stick close to the central tendency. Generation 1 are soldiers, generation 2 are traders, generation 3 are farmers, and generation 4 is back to war. Traits are not significantly amplified because of the consistent shifting around.

Evolution is long-term. Hardy-Weinberg equilibrium is short-term and reversible. It can work over just a few generations. So, for example, the Persians, who's religion was Zoroastrian, had court astrologers, maji or magi (magicians, which being unacceptable to to some early Christians became "wise men"). Relative numbers of these in the society would fluctuate with the winds of history, but for a while it was a real cherry of a job. Persia doesn't seem to have all that many now, as Zoroastrians are a small minority there. The point is, Persia had a lot of very smart people (capable administrators, able to organize logistics for million-man armies, built pontoon bridges over the Hellespont), and I'd argue that they still do, although it could just be that the smart ones now live in the US. I know a dozen or so Iranians, and every one of them is smart.

Demand for soldiers also ebbs and flows, and the 4-generation cycle is credible, if probably too regular. However, that particular profession tends to reduce gene transmission, especially on the losing side. However, losers might find their sons drafted into, for example, the Janissaries. Or in Egypt, the Mamluks. Don't get Jerry Pournelle started on either subject. In either case, while being drafted meant you were a slave for life, you could become a very privileged slave, and eventually those slaves became a ruling class, and very successful at passing their genes on. To this day, nothing happens in Egypt unless the military allows it ... that is Mamluk influence at work.

As for the stage of development achieved shortly before the Golden Age, this particular hypothesis puts it at about 3000 years ago. I'll note that its not all that far removed in time from the scourge of the Sea People and some other upheavals in the Mediterranean. Which subject SIGMA, Jerry including, was discussing just a few weeks ago. Hypothesis in question: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicamerali ... chology%29

According to one critic: "It is one of those books that is either complete rubbish or a work of consummate genius, nothing in between! Probably the former, but I'm hedging my bets."

Polygamy is a very interesting strategy practiced in areas from which we believe civilization sprang. It skews gene prevalence significantly.

[djolds1]

Human traits usually stick close to the central tendency. Generation 1 are soldiers, generation 2 are traders, generation 3 are farmers, and generation 4 is back to war. Traits are not significantly amplified because of the consistent shifting around.

Evolution is long-term.

Not necessarily. More current evidence indicates that evolution is frequent and rapid, not the "there has been no significant human evolution in 50,000 years" slog we thought it was 40 years ago.

Demand for soldiers also ebbs and flows, and the 4-generation cycle is credible, if probably too regular.

My example was illustrative only. The point is that consistent multi-generational trait amplification is rare.

However, that particular profession tends to reduce gene transmission, especially on the losing side.

Not necessarily. Chicks love uniforms. Chicks love bad boys. And before sixty years ago, indulging those loves tended to result in offspring of the loved traits. Regardless of whether or not daddy survived. Also, war offers opportunity for... reproductive strategies that are frowned upon in peacetime. Opportunities available to all sides.

Hypothesis in question: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicamerali ... chology%29

According to one critic: "It is one of those books that is either complete rubbish or a work of consummate genius, nothing in between! Probably the former, but I'm hedging my bets."

Sounds... improbable. I prefer Jonathan Haidt's metaphor - the rider serves the elephant. A metaphor which fits VERY well with millennia of observation as well as the latest EEG and fMRI brain observations.

Polygamy is a very interesting strategy practiced in areas from which we believe civilization sprang. It skews gene prevalence significantly.

Not sure how that effects r/K swings in population dynamics.

[Tom Ligon]

Polygamy means one fellow can have many wives if he is rich enough to afford them. One imagines that usually means he has the wits to accumulate wealth (although exceptions are abundant). So where polygamy is the norm, the wealthy pass on their genes disproportionately. And polygamy is likely when wars or other dangers cause high male mortality. There have been societies that engaged in war specifically to reduce competition from other males.

Even where polygamy is prohibited, we have examples such as Ben Franklin. Not known as the father of his country, but a lot of folks in France claim him as an ancestor.

In bees, one queen may have 10-20 husbands. The drones are all haploid, essentially sperm with wings. And honeybees are a genetic laboratory ... lots of gene swapping goes on, not the classic transcription with the rare single-base-pair mutation we were taught in class. There are some built-in mechanisms that tend to make inbreeding in bees unsuccessful, too.

[Tom Ligon]

"The rider serves the elephant."

If the elephants are pink, this may be a good time to mention the idea that yeasts influenced humans to create the conditions ideal for yeasts. There is evidence that the basis for civilization is the making of beer. By this argument, civilization was created by yeasts for the benefit of yeasts. That supposedly kicked in about 7000 years ago.

The other side of this is that beer is almost certainly the first date rape drug. And there we get into that whole unsavory means of passing on genes that also is found it war.

[MSimon]

https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2014/12/2 ... f-the-sea/

[djolds1]

Polygamy means one fellow can have many wives if he is rich enough to afford them. One imagines that usually means he has the wits to accumulate wealth (although exceptions are abundant). So where polygamy is the norm, the wealthy pass on their genes disproportionately. And polygamy is likely when wars or other dangers cause high male mortality. There have been societies that engaged in war specifically to reduce competition from other males.

Even where polygamy is prohibited, we have examples such as Ben Franklin. Not known as the father of his country, but a lot of folks in France claim him as an ancestor.

In bees, one queen may have 10-20 husbands. The drones are all haploid, essentially sperm with wings. And honeybees are a genetic laboratory ... lots of gene swapping goes on, not the classic transcription with the rare single-base-pair mutation we were taught in class. There are some built-in mechanisms that tend to make inbreeding in bees unsuccessful, too.

Sure, but from an r/K perspective, the father is investing less per child in a polygamous setting. Or may be investing less per child.

"The rider serves the elephant."

If the elephants are pink,

It isn't.

Haidt uses the terms as metaphors for conscious reason (the rider) and the passions (the elephant). Conscious reason is almost always an after the fact rationalization, not the guiding director we like to think it is.

this may be a good time to mention the idea that yeasts influenced humans to create the conditions ideal for yeasts. There is evidence that the basis for civilization is the making of beer. By this argument, civilization was created by yeasts for the benefit of yeasts. That supposedly kicked in about 7000 years ago.

I liked George Carlin's take - human civilization came about because the Earth wanted to create plastic. And now that plastic exists, human civilization is superfluous.

The other side of this is that beer is almost certainly the first date rape drug. And there we get into that whole unsavory means of passing on genes that also is found it war.

That's a bit harsh. Beer is probably one of the most successful "willing-and-happy reproduction" promoters in human history. More than a few members of this forum probably wouldn't have the particular kids they have without its wondrous interventions.

[Tom Ligon]

I wasn't sure how much I should say about Jerry Pournelle's condition until I checked his Chaos Manor website and found the message below from him. He'd e-mailed SIGMA a short note about it, complaining about having to type with one finger. This thread reminded me of a time I touched off an exchange on the Janissaries, on which Jerry is an authority. That brought up the Mamelukes, at which point Jerry said they'd show up in the novel Janissaries IV, if he ever gets around to finishing it. So here's wishing him a speedy recovery and better typing.

>> Monday Dec. 25, I had a stroke. I think my head is all right, and I am recovering. Alas I used to be a touch typist and I am now learning to be a two finger typist. At present I am a one finger typist. Call it 1.1 finger, but after today’s therapy , maybe 1.2; I am learning. I just made the Spock sign.

Started a ramble to post, but it is easy with Windows 8 to have what you write vanish. I will keep trying.

Please someone post in my blog that I am here and learning. The Surface works but learning to use it and Outlook 13
after a stroke is hard enough and I am clumsy. But I am trying and think I will recover. But it takes time.

But I am coming back. <<

[Diogenes]

I wasn't sure how much I should say about Jerry Pournelle's condition until I checked his Chaos Manor website and found the message below from him. He'd e-mailed SIGMA a short note about it, complaining about having to type with one finger. This thread reminded me of a time I touched off an exchange on the Janissaries, on which Jerry is an authority. That brought up the Mamelukes, at which point Jerry said they'd show up in the novel Janissaries IV, if he ever gets around to finishing it. So here's wishing him a speedy recovery and better typing.

>> Monday Dec. 25, I had a stroke. I think my head is all right, and I am recovering. Alas I used to be a touch typist and I am now learning to be a two finger typist. At present I am a one finger typist. Call it 1.1 finger, but after today’s therapy , maybe 1.2; I am learning. I just made the Spock sign.

Started a ramble to post, but it is easy with Windows 8 to have what you write vanish. I will keep trying.

Please someone post in my blog that I am here and learning. The Surface works but learning to use it and Outlook 13
after a stroke is hard enough and I am clumsy. But I am trying and think I will recover. But it takes time.

But I am coming back. <<

Am sorry to hear this. Jerry Pournelle has long been one of my favorite authors. Tell him this fan wishes him a speedy recovery.


On another topic, I am pleased to find myself currently in the position of being a reader rather than a writer. It's been a long time since I have seen so much interesting and insightful commentary to read.