Attn: Tom Ligon

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hanelyp
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Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby hanelyp » Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:24 am

The latest Freefall (the one right after http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff3000/fc02976.htm, direct permalink not yet available).
Image
The daylight is uncomfortably bright for eyes so long in the dark.

Tom Ligon
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Tom Ligon » Thu Jun 08, 2017 10:07 pm

Ah, you noticed!

How many TP participants are also Freefall fans? I know Kunkmeister is.

Jerry Pournelle got me into it.

paperburn1
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby paperburn1 » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:36 am

following for a year , about half way into the backlog of old comics
I am not a nuclear physicist, but play one on the internet.

kunkmiester
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby kunkmiester » Fri Jun 09, 2017 5:02 am

You using the speed reader Paperburn?

I had a chuckle, jab yet to read your response over there, but I was surprised to see someone else mention it over here.
Evil is evil, no matter how small

Taliesin
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Taliesin » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:29 am

I have read over half of them in the last year. Very amusing!

Tom Ligon
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Tom Ligon » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:13 pm

Taliesin,

Welcome aboard ... first time I've seen your name here.

What brings you to TalkPolywell? Your name suggests a Frank Lloyd Wright connection. An intrest in Freefall suggests a hard science fiction interest.

Tom

Taliesin
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Taliesin » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:01 am

Thank you Tom,
I have followed this forum for over 10 years, before Dr Bussard passed away and have enjoyed the predominantly professional discussions here. It is a little sad that the forward momentum on new Polywell information has slowed in recent years, although it is understandable.

Your post have always been some of the most concise and insightful here and it made me smile when I saw the freefall strip with your name on it.
I assume you know the author from your writing activities? It is a shame you don't post more often.

Whilst I have a strong interest in Physics, I have little I could add here that would be of material benefit so generally do not post, hence being somewhat anonymous. :-)

Again, thank you for the welcome.
Eric

Tom Ligon
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Tom Ligon » Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:39 pm

No, I don't know Mark personally. Several years ago, Jerry Pournelle, whom I know pretty well, was participating in a discussion with the SIGMA think tank on the subject of the threat of AIs to humanity's future. Jerry has apparently been a fan for years, and told us we should read it. He thought the tendency of the AIs to find workarounds for their safeguards was worth thinking about. I looked it up, and binge-read it from the start.

Mark drops Easter eggs such as the name of that ship into the story to amuse the participants in the Freefall forum. He figured out who I was and used the name. I certainly don't mind ... beats the heck out of Star Trek TNG calling a planet Ligon II, in what some people consider the worst ST episode ever.

I would post more if there were anything I could tell. I think EMC2 is still active. On last contact Dr. Park was sure it would work (because they had finally hit high beta), which was a huge change from when I first met him. My hope is they found private funding from an angel, who has put them back under wraps. That's just a guess based on the number of prospective angels who contacted Dr. Bussard thru me back around 2007. Dr. Park is not hard to contact compared to RWB, so they're no longer coming to me.

ladajo
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby ladajo » Wed Jul 05, 2017 4:42 pm

Tom,
They are doing sims work right now. About all I can say. Jaeyoung (and I) remains optimistic. He is doing "some real science" as I termed it to him a few weeks back.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)
What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Taliesin
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Taliesin » Thu Jul 06, 2017 1:29 am

Ahh yes, the infamous Ligonians from NextGen, that was very early doors for the series. They certainly did not have their act together at that stage. Yar was still their security chief at that stage. Seems like a lifetime ago.

Ladajo,
I have also thoroughly enjoyed your comments in the ‘LENR is Real’ threads. It has almost single handedly kept me coming back to this forum over the last few months (and Dancing fools recent contributions). Your steam analysis was perfect! Such a shame no one was foolish enough to debate it.

Ladajo, did DR.Park get a chance to build WB7.1 or WB8 for the any of the confinement\density work or is it all simulation based now? I remember that they only got 4 attempts at detecting fusion bubbles before WB6 went up in smoke, did they get a better sample rate after this?

Eric

ladajo
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby ladajo » Thu Jul 06, 2017 3:39 pm

Taliesin,
Thanks for your comment. I do make an effort (occasionally) to make my posts contain a degree of entertainment. I have feared at times that the entertainment value has been lost on some...
If I have contributed to your interest in Talk-Polywell, then great! I would also like to think that there are others here who have as well. In the discourse on Rossiclown, I have made several technical arguments relating to the design/engineering side, none of which to date have been refuted to my knowledge. I am always open to critique. The door remains open, as it provides opportunities for us all to learn. Unfortunately, the chief Rossiclown cheerleaders have seemed to be blinded by emotion, and not open to (admitted) learning. Thus no rebuttals. :(

EMC built and operated 7.1 and 8. The work on 8 led to what I like to call "Mini-B", which was built to specifically explore plasma start up process and conditions post WB8. The (literally cutting edge) sim work ongoing is studying the principle operating aspects of the machine. The sought after outcome is a theoretical refinement and a practical design basis for building a live proof of concept machine. As I understand, this effort is anticipated to be completed this year. Then EMC will look to build the proof of concept. That said, it is science, and shit happens. I am limited in my ability to share as, for now, Jaeyoung prefers they keep a low profile.

Edit: Spelling
Last edited by ladajo on Thu Jul 06, 2017 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The development of atomic power, though it could confer unimaginable blessings on mankind, is something that is dreaded by the owners of coal mines and oil wells. (Hazlitt)

What I want to do is to look up C. . . . I call him the Forgotten Man. (Sumner)

Tom Ligon
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Tom Ligon » Thu Jul 06, 2017 5:00 pm

To which I can add that Dr. Park is a meticulous scientist. Much as I liked working for Dr. Bussard, he was clearly very much in love with his concept. While the broad strokes of his approach felt right, the theoretical basis had some holes that needed data. Computers at the time were not capable of running the sorts of deep 3D finite element calculations needed for quality simulations, and he concluded you'd get there faster by testing real machines than modeling. But those holes in the theory, in the meantime, meant he patched them with supposition, and, at times what can only be called wishful thinking. Most importantly, he tended to see wiffleballs forming in his data interpretation when Dr. Park believes that we never got anywhere close. Without wiffleballs, approaching the beta = 1 condition, i.e. plasma pressure equaling magnetic confinement pressure, the Polywell has no real advantage. It is the enormous increase in reaction rate of increasing plasma pressure that makes this approach worthwhile.

With no personal fish to fry, Dr. Park (and also Dr. Nebel, who handled the front office before handing the whole thing over to Park) treated their involvement from the start as an attempt to replicate Dr. Bussard's work, if possible, and if not, to disprove it. In other words, to do science.

It has been fun to watch Dr. Park progress with this, from skeptic, to figuring out what was wrong, to figuring out what was needed to make it actually work, to believing EMC2 is on to the best chance for fusion. He's also a heckuva good instrumentation and diagnostics guy ... I'd have to say he upped EMC2's lab game by 1 1/2 orders of magnitude. He measures things directly that Dr. Bussard wished he could. And then analyzed the data more critically.

As a result of this care and critical analysis, Dr. Park was able to build Mini-B and coax it into wiffleballs reproducibly.

Now, to get this back on to the original topic, I need to convince Mark Stanley to incorporate Polywell tech into the Freefall strip. I have dropped a few hints. He's got the background to follow this stuff.

kunkmiester
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby kunkmiester » Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:39 pm

I had mentioned it on the forum a long time ago, you'd have to do so one digging for it. I think at this point though there is too much Tokomak. Like his data slabs which remain a bulkier version of tablets like he originally envisioned, it's a legacy he'll probably leave in since there's ten years of precedent. Short of a poly well going into commercial operation, I don't see much point from a story telling view of changing things much.
Evil is evil, no matter how small

Taliesin
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Taliesin » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:35 am

I can see it now.. Florence discovers WB800 under blankets in the ships hold as Sam stole it from the Smithsonian institute.. thinking he could steal the Liquid salt coolant for a meal.

Tom Ligon
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Re: Attn: Tom Ligon

Postby Tom Ligon » Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:53 am

There's another former Talk-Polyweller on Freefall's forum at the moment, posting as JohnDoe. Hah, a likely alias, I say! I'll see if I can get him to fess up his TP ID.


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