10KW LENR demonstrator (new thread)

[nasonex]

The evidence that Rossi's technology works is already out there. Everyone but the die hard cynics are convinced. I do not have to review the data. If the cynics on this forum can lie and say the technology does not work, I can tell the truth by saying it does work.

If the cynics want to ignore me, that is fine. I am not here to convince them of anything. I'm here simply to counteract some of the hostility and lies I've been reading on this forum with truth.

Please feel free to call me a Rossibot. I'll wear it with honor. Why? Because his technology works. When his devices go on the market and are sold at Home Depot, I'll make sure everyone who called me a Rossibot is remembered.

By the way, I do believe that the cynics out there are bad. They are the worst examples of humanity.

nasonex,
If you are going to post around here you had better be prepared to back yourself up with facts and analysis.
Making sweeping statements, then repeating them over and over is a good way to get yourself ignored.

You sound like a Rossibot.

Critically defend what you say if you want any game here. If you do not, you will become one of two things, completely ignored, or a play toy for veteran forum members to kick around.

If you have something useful to add, please, jump in. If you are going to be a Rossibot, and add nothing of substance, go somewhere else.

Rossi has most certainly not provided any evidence that he has what he claims. If you think he has, then you are not evaluating his "tests" in a comprehensive critical manner. Middleschool science students do a better job setting up and running experiments than Rossi has. All the man needs to do is heat a bucket of water. It couldn't get any more simpler. He refuses. This is the baseline truth in all of the drama. All the speculation is around why.

Cite and analyze an Ecat run and prove your point. I posit that you cannot do so, and will be reduced to handwaving, speculation and emotional discourse. This will eventually lead to you insulting someone, and then declaring that non-believers are bad, and not just bad, but puppets and snakes sharing in a global conspiracy to deny real science.

Have at it.

Edit: my usual plethora of typos.

[nasonex]

I'm not going to play games with you.

The tests in 2011 showed conclusive proof of excess heat.

There were a couple tests I am aware of that had problems due to leaking water. However, test after test showed excess heat.

Perhaps my favorite example is the 18 hour test performed by Dr. Levi in which the device produced 10 to 15 kilowatts of constant output. The output also spiked at one point to 120-130 kilowatts, which required them to throttle down the system. This was a simple test in which the temperature of water was increased.

Of course like most of the pseudo-skeptics with agendas, you will probably claim that we cannot trust the data because Dr. Levi is involved in a conspiracy with Rossi.

Since Dr. Levi's data isn't available, I remain unconvinced. Show me the data report and I'll look though it. If you want to argue with the big boys you gotta cite data, not rumors and hearsay. Repeating a comment does not make it true. So as I requested previously, cite any test with data. I'll gladly read through any reports.

The report is out there. I do not have to quote it in this forum.

Those who have been following saga (and who are not die hard cynics) already know of it and the many other tests that have been performed. The tests show that the technology works and produces huge amounts of excess heat.

Feel free to bash me, attack me, or belittle me. I don't care, because I know I'm right.

I just hope the cynics who have been attacking Rossi will resign from any science related job they may have when they realize their neibors are using home E-Cat units.

Of course they won't, because the cynics are the most disgusting human beings on the planet. In their twisted warped mind they think they are defending science from the "danger" of an unproven concept.

[Enginerd]

By the way, I do believe that the cynics out there are bad. They are the worst examples of humanity.

People who suspend belief until provided with compelling evidence are "bad"? People who demand extraordinary proof before accepting extraordinary claims are "the worst examples of humanity"?

Presumably you feel similarly about those who fail to accept the Bible / the Book of Mormon / the Koran / [whatever random holy book], because the existence of the universe clearly demonstrates the truth of [whatever your religious beliefs happen to be]. Those who believe purely on faith without seeing evidence are good. Those that require evidence are bad. Got it.

Thanks for sharing your religion with us today. Do run along now, k?

[Skipjack]

Everyone but the die hard cynics are convinced.

Ahh an opportunty for my favorite quote from the TV- show "Monk":
Monk:"Everybody would be so much happier..."
Sharona:"Who is everyone?"
Monk:"Me...and...me...".

So nasonex let me ask you as well:"Who is everyone?"
You and...?

The report is out there.

Awe come on, we wont get you away that easily. "Out there" and "the tests" and "huge amounts" is not enough. We want numbers, tesing procedures, exact measurements with protocols that are not easily fooled by "mistakes".

Of course they won't, because the cynics are the most disgusting human beings on the planet.

You should hear yourself! Has anyone here called you names? Has anyone here attacked you personally?
Why do you think you need to attack skeptics like that instead of using your superior knowledge to convince us? So far I have not seen a single citation, not a single theory, nothing that is convincing. All I have seen is Rossi contradicting himself over and over again.

[parallel]

nasonex,

Suggest you ignore the trolls like Skipjack.

A couple pages ago he got it wrong about Dick Smith offering money and when I wrote

As I stated on the previous page, you have a problem of not being able to tell the difference between something happening or not happening, so there is no point is debating with you.

he pretended it was about something else rather than admit his error.

[Skipjack]

Suggest you ignore the trolls like Skipjack.

Ahh, I guess "everyone" is "Parallel and nasonex". Well he certainly is in "good company" there.

[ScottL]

I'm not going to play games with you.

The tests in 2011 showed conclusive proof of excess heat.

There were a couple tests I am aware of that had problems due to leaking water. However, test after test showed excess heat.

Perhaps my favorite example is the 18 hour test performed by Dr. Levi in which the device produced 10 to 15 kilowatts of constant output. The output also spiked at one point to 120-130 kilowatts, which required them to throttle down the system. This was a simple test in which the temperature of water was increased.

Of course like most of the pseudo-skeptics with agendas, you will probably claim that we cannot trust the data because Dr. Levi is involved in a conspiracy with Rossi.

Since Dr. Levi's data isn't available, I remain unconvinced. Show me the data report and I'll look though it. If you want to argue with the big boys you gotta cite data, not rumors and hearsay. Repeating a comment does not make it true. So as I requested previously, cite any test with data. I'll gladly read through any reports.

The report is out there. I do not have to quote it in this forum.

Those who have been following saga (and who are not die hard cynics) already know of it and the many other tests that have been performed. The tests show that the technology works and produces huge amounts of excess heat.

Feel free to bash me, attack me, or belittle me. I don't care, because I know I'm right.

I just hope the cynics who have been attacking Rossi will resign from any science related job they may have when they realize their neibors are using home E-Cat units.

Of course they won't, because the cynics are the most disgusting human beings on the planet. In their twisted warped mind they think they are defending science from the "danger" of an unproven concept.

Prof. Levi's report is not out there. It's not currently published anywhere. We've been asking for it for over a year and still have not gotten it. In my opinion he's full data report could quiet alot of the criticisms much as Rossi boiling some water, but neither have happened. I want to see the 18hr data points. Point me to a link....anywhere....to the report. I've looked, I can't find it anywhere.

Nasonex, aside from your name being a nasal drip product, I'm just going to assume you're a troll trying to stir the pot. You can assume from here on out that you're ignored most likely from the rest of us.

On to the topic again....

When will Rossi provide any evidence, any what-so-ever, of his claims? Probably never....

[nasonex]

The compelling evidence already exists. But the cynics will not accept it due to being brainwashed by the cult of mainstream science that preaches cold fusion is impossible.

This topic has zero to do with religion. You are showing your extreme pseudo-skepticism by bringing that up. The fact is Andrea Rossi allowed a dozen public tests of his system in 2011 and there were other private tests by the DOD and others. The technology works. However, folks like you will deny it for a number of reasons, one of which is that you are too closed minded to accept that mainstream science can be wrong.

By the way, I do believe that the cynics out there are bad. They are the worst examples of humanity.

People who suspend belief until provided with compelling evidence are "bad"? People who demand extraordinary proof before accepting extraordinary claims are "the worst examples of humanity"?

Presumably you feel similarly about those who fail to accept the Bible / the Book of Mormon / the Koran / [whatever random holy book], because the existence of the universe clearly demonstrates the truth of [whatever your religious beliefs happen to be]. Those who believe purely on faith without seeing evidence are good. Those that require evidence are bad. Got it.

Thanks for sharing your religion with us today. Do run along now, k?

[nasonex]

The report is out there. He shared his results and they were reported on by NyTeknik and other outlets. The facts are simple. A couple hundred watts in, and a constant output of around 10 to 15 kilowatts for 18 hours.

Of course you will not accept it because he did not give out a "formal" report with every little tiny bit of data.

However, he did share all the important information with NyTeknik and others, and that is enough for any reasonable person.

Basically, you are saying he is incompetent and unqualified to perform such a test.

Since Dr. Levi's data isn't available, I remain unconvinced. Show me the data report and I'll look though it. If you want to argue with the big boys you gotta cite data, not rumors and hearsay. Repeating a comment does not make it true. So as I requested previously, cite any test with data. I'll gladly read through any reports.

The report is out there. I do not have to quote it in this forum.

Those who have been following saga (and who are not die hard cynics) already know of it and the many other tests that have been performed. The tests show that the technology works and produces huge amounts of excess heat.

Feel free to bash me, attack me, or belittle me. I don't care, because I know I'm right.

I just hope the cynics who have been attacking Rossi will resign from any science related job they may have when they realize their neibors are using home E-Cat units.

Of course they won't, because the cynics are the most disgusting human beings on the planet. In their twisted warped mind they think they are defending science from the "danger" of an unproven concept.

Prof. Levi's report is not out there. It's not currently published anywhere. We've been asking for it for over a year and still have not gotten it. In my opinion he's full data report could quiet alot of the criticisms much as Rossi boiling some water, but neither have happened. I want to see the 18hr data points. Point me to a link....anywhere....to the report. I've looked, I can't find it anywhere.

Nasonex, aside from your name being a nasal drip product, I'm just going to assume you're a troll trying to stir the pot. You can assume from here on out that you're ignored most likely from the rest of us.

On to the topic again....

When will Rossi provide any evidence, any what-so-ever, of his claims? Probably never....

[nasonex]

Everyone but the die hard cynics are convinced.

Ahh an opportunty for my favorite quote from the TV- show "Monk":
Monk:"Everybody would be so much happier..."
Sharona:"Who is everyone?"
Monk:"Me...and...me...".

So nasonex let me ask you as well:"Who is everyone?"
You and...?

The report is out there.

Awe come on, we wont get you away that easily. "Out there" and "the tests" and "huge amounts" is not enough. We want numbers, tesing procedures, exact measurements with protocols that are not easily fooled by "mistakes".

Of course they won't, because the cynics are the most disgusting human beings on the planet.

You should hear yourself! Has anyone here called you names? Has anyone here attacked you personally?
Why do you think you need to attack skeptics like that instead of using your superior knowledge to convince us? So far I have not seen a single citation, not a single theory, nothing that is convincing. All I have seen is Rossi contradicting himself over and over again.

He is a qualified scientist and he gave the numbers and calculations that matter.

Those numbers show a huge gain of energy, just like the other tests that Rossi performed.

You deny them because you think cold fusion is impossible, period.

I will insult the die-hard skeptics day and night, because they have already insulted every human being on this planet by contributing to the suppression of the E-Cat technology.

I don't have to give a theory or anything else. The fact is that reasonable people who look at the test results so far will see Rossi's technology works.

By the way, I'll keep on writing here even if every cynic on the forum ignores me. I'm here, and going no where. I'm not writing to impress the cynical pukes that try to keep us in the dark ages.

[Carl White]

nasonex, while I'm more hopeful there's something to Rossi's work than most people on this board, even I have to admit that no definitive proof has been offered to the world at large. Only tantalizing hints.

It's not worth it to fight this battle right now. If Rossi has something, then presumably so does Defkalion. In fact, Defkalion is proceeding in a much more open manner and has declared independent tests will be conducted over the next several weeks.

We should have much better data in a matter of a couple of months. Even so, let's face it: many skeptics will just find new reasons to object no matter how positive the data looks. This isn't going to be fully accepted until Hyperions or E-Cats are running in homes and businesses. Might as well sit back and enjoy the story as it unfolds. Rossi and Defkalion don't need to be defended, they just need to carry on (if they truly have something).

[Giorgio]

Extraordinary claims do not require extraordinary evidence.

They only require the same evidence as anything else.

Demanding extraordinary evidence is ridiculous.

However, Rossi did provide extraordinary evidence with the dozen tests he performed in 2011, and the other tests he allowed in private.

The technology works and it is real.

For one Rossibot that fades away another Rossibot takes his place.

[nasonex]

That is where we disagree.

I believe that absolute proof of the E-Cat has been provided.

I also think it is everyone's duty to defend true scientists (like Rossi) from the cynical naysayers.

I know that people are going to scream and yell because I called Rossi a true scientist. However, despite his flaws, he is more of a scientist than the closed minded pieces of filth that have been suppressing cold fusion for the past 20 years. He is more of a scientist than Dr. Park or any of the cynics out there that try to attack him.

He has developed a robust and powerful cold fusion technology that will end up on the market. That is 1000 times more than any of the cynical naysayers will ever accomplish in their pathetic careers.

I am not enjoying the show at all. I want it accelerated. I'm looking forward to when all the cynics on this board and elsewhere are exposed as the non-scientists they are!

I hope every last one of the psudo-skeptics that have attacked Rossi loses their jobs, and have their academic credentials yanked. I also hope MIT is censured and has their funding cut for the suppression that took place there.

Again, I'm not trying to convince the cynics. I'm trying to be a voice for the truth. The truth is what matters here.

Cold fusion technology is going to change the world, and I'm going to make sure that when people look back they see SOMEONE was trying to stand up for the truth.

nasonex, while I'm more hopeful there's something to Rossi's work than most people on this board, even I have to admit that no definitive proof has been offered to the world at large. Only tantalizing hints.

It's not worth it to fight this battle right now. If Rossi has something, then presumably so does Defkalion. In fact, Defkalion is proceeding in a much more open manner and has declared independent tests will be conducted over the next several weeks.

We should have much better data in a matter of a couple of months. Even so, let's face it: many skeptics will just find new reasons to object no matter how positive the data looks. This isn't going to be fully accepted until Hyperions or E-Cats are running in homes and businesses. Might as well sit back and enjoy the story as it unfolds. Rossi and Defkalion don't need to be defended, they just need to carry on (if they truly have something).

[nasonex]

Extraordinary claims do not require extraordinary evidence.

They only require the same evidence as anything else.

Demanding extraordinary evidence is ridiculous.

However, Rossi did provide extraordinary evidence with the dozen tests he performed in 2011, and the other tests he allowed in private.

The technology works and it is real.

For one Rossibot that fades away another Rossibot takes his place.

Absolutely! I'm proud to be a Rossi-bot.

What are you going to do when there are about five billion Rossi-bots when the E-Cat technology goes on the market?

Your psuedo-skepticism will disqualify you as becoming one.

Of course most of the cynics will probably LIE and claim they thought that the Rossi technology worked all along.

I will be there shouting to everyone that they did not think the technology worked all along, and worked hard to suppress it.

[Enginerd]

What are you going to do when there are about five billion Rossi-bots when the E-Cat technology goes on the market?

If the "E-Cat technology" were being sold, it could be independently tested by anybody who chose to buy and test one. No skepticism would be necessary.

This goes to the heart of why skepticism is currently in order -- belief in whether the e-cat works, or does not work, is simply based on belief (or disbelief) in what Rossi claims the e-cat does. Rossi is the prophet of the e-cat -- You believe Rossi, so you believe in the e-cat. Fine. With no way for you or anybody else to test this case, your belief is based on hearsay.

You do not have personal experience where you have personally verified Rossi's claims. You do not have published accounts of others having independently verified Rossi's claims. You have to rely on what the folks hawking the e-cat tell you is true. Maybe it is true. Maybe it isn't. This make your belief as sold as any religion -- you believe your prophet. Good for you. You are a true believer. Don't expect others to believe in your prophet until we have good reasons to believe. Good reasons to believe in something is called "evidence". A scientist is somebody who demands compelling evidence before believing a claim.

If Rossi (or anybody else claiming LENR or fusion or any other sort of power) will submit to a set of well controlled independent tests where they provide their 'black box' that can heat a flow of water by i.e. 30C continuously for 72 hours or more, then we will all have good reason to start believing something interesting is going on. For a device as amazing as the e-cat is claimed to be, that should be a simple thing. The world (and piles of money) would instantly show up at their door.

When Rossi proves his device (either by selling them, or submitting to an unequivocal demonstration), I will gladly believe. No proof -> no reason to believe.