10KW LENR Demonstrator?

Point out news stories, on the net or in mainstream media, related to polywell fusion.

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rjaypeters
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Post by rjaypeters »

chrismb wrote:IN fact, I would go further and say that the lowest states of a nucleus are where two-proton-two-neutron 'units' have formed,
Little 2p2n tetrahedra?
chrismb wrote:and the extra neutrons act like little spots of blu-tac and bind them together. So an excited nucleus is one where more 2p2n clustes could form up within the nucleus, but have not yet done so, and that higher atomic masses need bigger 'excesses' of neutrons (to stick all the 2p2n's together).
This, sort of, sounds like a crystal.
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence

R. Peters

Joseph Chikva
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Post by Joseph Chikva »

chrismb wrote:
rjaypeters wrote:That being said, in a discusson of nucleii, I would not presume a nucleus is 'soup-like' such that protons can work their way to the surface to get as far from each other. I think the world of the nucleus is more wierd than that. Like a puzzle of very similar parts but they only go together in a finite number of combinations, with some combinations holding more or less 'energy', accordingly. Thus, an excited nucleus is one of those finite combinations but that by changing into another ordered combination, energy can be released. That is my view of the nucleus.
May be you have your personal Large Hadrons Collider?
Shape of nucleus?
Now I understand why a number of undergrad guys look at you as on a great physicist. :)

bhl
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Joined: Fri May 20, 2011 11:52 pm

No cathode

Post by bhl »

Rossi says that a Bunsen burner could be used to generate the heat for the reaction. No cathode or volts required.
Waiting for my Ni powder to arrive. :D

Axil
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Post by Axil »

Giorgio wrote:
cg66 wrote:Assuming there is some effect of H packed in the Ni that allows transmutation, is there a benefit to heading towards Cu that prevents positron production (and therefore subsequent gammas)?
I will give a look to the paper during the WE.
I really still do not see any potential mechanism that could prevent positron (and consequent gamma) emissions.
For this reason I was stating that there must be new science involved.
I really still do not see any potential mechanism that could prevent positron (and consequent gamma) emissions.
For this reason I was stating that there must be new science involved.
The quantum mechanical behavior of coherent and entangled matter is not that well understood currently.

I believe that when nuclear reactions take place when matter is in this coherent and entangled state, nuclear radiation is suppressed in favor of lattice heating.

This is not new science, but only an unusual and little understood outcome of quantum mechanical behavior between radiation and exotic matter.
Last edited by Axil on Fri May 27, 2011 7:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Axil
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Re: No cathode

Post by Axil »

bhl wrote:Rossi says that a Bunsen burner could be used to generate the heat for the reaction. No cathode or volts required.
Waiting for my Ni powder to arrive. :D
Be very careful. Ni nanopowder is toxic; Ware breathing filtration while handling it.

Giorgio
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Post by Giorgio »

Axil wrote:The quantum mechanical behavior of coherent and entangled matter is not that well understood currently.

I believe that when nuclear reactions take place when matter is in this coherent and entangled state, nuclear radiation is suppressed in favor of lattice heating.

This is not new science, but only an unusual and little understood outcome of quantum mechanical behavior between radiation and exotic matter.
What entangled state?
Do you think you can get a Nickel powder in an hydrogen atmosphere into an entangled state simply by supplying heat ?

What exotic matter?

Axil
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Post by Axil »

Giorgio wrote:
Axil wrote:The quantum mechanical behavior of coherent and entangled matter is not that well understood currently.

I believe that when nuclear reactions take place when matter is in this coherent and entangled state, nuclear radiation is suppressed in favor of lattice heating.

This is not new science, but only an unusual and little understood outcome of quantum mechanical behavior between radiation and exotic matter.
What entangled state?
Do you think you can get a Nickel powder in an hydrogen atmosphere into an entangled state simply by supplying heat ?

What exotic matter?

In the Rossi reactor, I believe that clusters of coherent, entangled and inverted ultra dense Rydburg hydrogen condensate crystals are formed on the surface of a doped solid such as graphite. The graphite is most likely coated with potassium. Such clusters of ions attain a long average lifetime due to the high pressure and temperatures maintained within the hydrogen envelope of the reaction vessel. This long lifetime is sufficient to permit the ions to drift across the hot high pressure hydrogen envelope. Once they reach the etched nickel oxide nano-powder affixed to the reaction vessel walls, a hybrid hydride reaction occurs with the highly eroded nickel oxide surface layer.


Rydburg matter.


In more detail, the formation of Rydburg hydrogen is most easily formed from the surfaces of carbon or metal oxides. These planar clusters have six-fold symmetry and contain 7, 19, 37, 61, or 91 atoms. These numbers are the so called magic numbers for closed-pack clusters.

An alkaline metal with an electric low work function can catalyze the Rydburg cluster emissions especially from the surface of a carbon solid. A metal oxide as the source of Rydburg hydrogen is not possible because the hydrogen envelope would erode its surface to the point of ineffectiveness.

There appears to be and electronic mechanism that allows a potassium coating to form Rydburg crystals at or very near the surface of a graphite substrate.


Under the assumption that the fusion of these variously sized Rydburg clusters is at the bottom of the Rossi reaction, this distribution in the number of protons based on Rydburg magic number could be the mechanism that produces the various light elements found in the nuclear ash of the Rossi reactor.


In these Rydburg clusters, the electrons provide the main structure in which the ions are moving. The ion cores are embedded in a sea of electrons which shield the ions from each other as in an ordinary metal.


Because they are quantum mechanically entangled, these multi-atom crystals of hydrogen behave as a single atom. These clusters are very long lived and grow increasingly ionized by atomic and electron impacts that come from the high pressure and temperature of the hydrogen envelope. These increasing ionization levels extend the lifetimes of the ions.


Reference:
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/cond-mat/pdf/ ... 3715v4.pdf

It is nevertheless already clear from the above data that entangled states are favored in the stoichiometric regime. The existence of a low temperature phase in which all the deuterons cohere in a mesoscopically entangled state is hence strongly indicated.

The only state of hydrogen where the “low temperature phase in which all the deuterons cohere” is hydrogen formed as Rydburg matter. Forming hydrogen in a fermionic condensate is near impossible in any other way and requires ultra low temperatures.

Rydberg ions and molecules

One of the metastable states of strongly non-ideal plasma is Rydberg matter, which forms upon condensation of excited atoms. These atoms can also turn into ions and electrons if they reach a certain temperature. In April 2009, Nature reported the creation of Rydberg molecules from a Rydberg atom and a ground state atom, confirming that such a state of matter could exist. The experiment was performed using ultracold rubidium atoms.


More generally, these clusters behave and in fact mimic negatively charged hydrogen ions with sufficiently long lifetimes to enter into the lattice defects.


These defects have been produced by hydrogen erosion of the nickel oxide nano-powder when the hydrogen gas was first loaded into the reaction chamber at reactor startup.


After this adsorption step, these complex H- ions interact with the nickel atoms that form the walls of the lattice defect. It is possible that a number of these complex H- ions can be confined in the nickel lattice defect. In accordance with the Pauli Exclusion Principle and with the Heisenberg uncertainty principle, the conditions are created for replacing electrons of the nickel metal atoms with these complex entangled assemblages of hydrogen atoms, thereby forming metal-hydrogen complex atomic formations.

So at the end of this absorption process, these complex H- ions are adsorbed into the lattice interstices of the nano-powder, or by adsorption at the grain edges, by trapping the negatively charged Rydburg ions into the lattice defects; replacement of an atom of the nickel metal lattice holes may also occur.

This event can take place due to the fermion nature of these complex Rydburg H- ions; however, since H- ions have a very large composite atomic mass many times larger than an electron mass, they tend to penetrate very deeply into the nickel lattice structure of the nickel oxide nano-powder, and cause an emission of Auger electrons and of X rays.

Thermal oscillations in the metal lattice tend to compress the large number of highly compacted hydrogen atoms which comprise the Rydburg-ion(s) causing a structural reorganization of subatomic particles and freeing energy by mass defect; a fraction of the protons of this assemblage of sequestered hydrogen atoms will absorb and carry this fusion reaction energy which expels them at high speed from the local of the reaction as individual protons, and can generate secondary nuclear reactions within the immediately adjacent neighboring nickel metal cores.

A much denser state exists for hydrogen, named H(-1). It is called ultra-dense or degenerate hydrogen. This is the inverse of hydrogen at the ground state H(1), and the bond distance is very small, equal to 2.3 pm (0.023 angstroms). Its density is extremely large, >130 kg / cm3 (130,000 times as dense as water), if it can exist as a dense phase. Due to the short bond distance between subatomic particles, H-H fusion is expected to take place easily in this material.


This material is probably an inverted metal with the deuterons moving in the field from the stationary electrons. This reduces the size of the atom because the heavy nucleus orbits the light electron. This gives a predicted interatomic distance of 2.5 pm, close to the measured value. Experiments show that an ultra-dense deuterium material exists.

I have yet to see external experimental demonstration of inverted hydrogen H(-1) so far carried out, but if it existes as so far indicated in the Ross process a lot of it could fix inside a lattice defect.

The energy pumping actions of subatomic particles by phonons in the hot lattice is a primary causative factor which can stimulate and add energy to Rydburg matter to cause inversion to the H(-1) state. Once H(-1) is in the lattice defect, fusion is easy because the distances between sub atomic particles is so short. Just add a little pressure and you have fusion.

Giorgio
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Post by Giorgio »

I am not asking you the expected reaction, I am asking you how do you get to those states just by supplying heat to a Nickel powder in Hydrogen atmosphere?

Axil
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Post by Axil »

Giorgio wrote:I am not asking you the expected reaction, I am asking you how do you get to those states just by supplying heat to a Nickel powder in Hydrogen atmosphere?
When heat is applied to carbon coated with potassium in a hot high pressure hydrogen envelop, Rydberg hydrogen crystals are formed just above the surface of the carbon.

The eroded nickel powder provides ultra small Heisenberg cavities where the Heisenberg uncertainty principle accelerates the Rydberg hydrogen crystals. Energy is added due to the highly defined position of these crystals. A correspondently increase in the momentum of the crystals results and adds energy and pressure to complete the fusion process.

PS: This quote from Edmund Storms has always intrigued me. I always test a propective mechanisms for the Rossi reaction against this quote as follows:
Edmund Storms: Rossi hit upon this somewhat by accident. He was using a nickel catalyst to explore ways of making a fuel by combining hydrogen and carbon monoxide and apparently, observed quite by accident, that his [?????] was making extra energy. So then he explored it from that point of view and, apparently, over a year or two, amplified the effect.

He’s exploring the gas loading area of the field. This is also a region, a method used in the heavy water, or the heavy hydrogen, system. But in this case, it was light hydrogen, ordinary hydrogen and nickel and what happens is quite amazing.

You create the right conditions in the nickel, and he has a secret method for doing that, and all you do is add hydrogen to it and it makes huge amounts of energy based upon a nuclear reaction.”

The excess heat formed in nickel catalyst tests of CH4 production may be understood by the production of High-Rydburg(HR) states of hydrogen when excited CH4 decomposes and interacts with lattice faults in nickel.

parallel
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Post by parallel »

As forecast there is no new news yet. Bloggers in need of something to read could try the discussion page on wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Energy_Catalyzer I thought it interesting that Brian Josephson (yes the famous one) is a strong supporter of Rossi. He also described the demonstrations as scientific experiments, but what would he know compared to our resident pathological skeptics?

Earlier, someone doubted that an E-Cat has been used to power a factory. The address is given in Rossi's patent.
A practical embodiment of the inventive apparatus, installed on October 16, 2007, is at present perfectly operating 24 hours per day, and provides an amount of heat sufficient to heat the factory of the Company EON of via Carlo Ragazzi 18, at Bondeno (Province of Ferrara).
Curious that noone has taken the trouble to go and look at it. Must be easier to stay seated and write how it is all a fairy tale.

rjaypeters
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Post by rjaypeters »

Joseph Chikva wrote:May be you have your personal Large Hadrons Collider?
Shape of nucleus?
Now I understand why a number of undergrad guys look at you as on a great physicist.
Some people claim to some understanding of the subject, at least enough to write books about the geometry of atomic nuclei:

"Models of the Atomic Nucleus: with interactive software, Volume 1
By Norman D. Cook"

which Google Search was kind enough to show some pages when I searched for "atomic nucleus geometry." There is at least one description of the Euclidean geometry of the particles in the nucleus. Since the title of the book includes plural models, the face-centered cubic structure described in Chapter 9 may not be the last word on the subject (though the face-centered cubic structure does exhibit octahedral symmetry, hmm).

Then, there is this guy:

"Ben Roy Mottelson (born July 9, 1926) is a Danish American nuclear physicist. He won the 1975 Nobel Prize in Physics for his work on the non-spherical geometry of atomic nuclei."

[snip of biographical info]

"In 1950-51, James Rainwater and Aage Bohr had developed models of the atomic nucleus which began to take into account the behaviour of the individual nucleons. These models, which moved beyond the simpler liquid drop treatment of the nucleus as having effectively no internal structure, were the first models which could explain a number of nuclear properties, including the non-spherical distribution of charge in certain nuclei. Mottelson worked with Aage Bohr to compare the theoretical models with experimental data. In three papers which were published in 1952-53, Bohr and Mottelson demonstrated close agreement between theory and experiment, for example showing that the energy levels of certain nuclei could be described by a rotation spectrum. This work stimulated new theoretical and experimental studies.

Rainwater, Bohr and Mottelson were jointly awarded the 1975 Nobel Prize in Physics "for the discovery of the connection between collective motion and particle motion in atomic nuclei and the development of the theory of the structure of the atomic nucleus based on this connection".[1]

Bohr and Mottelson continued to work together, publishing a two-volume monograph, Nuclear Structure. The first volume, Single-Particle Motion, appeared in 1969, and the second volume, Nuclear Deformations, in 1975." from Dr. Mottelson's Wikipedia entry.

So there's enough to read for awhile. I love you guys, you cause me to look up the most interesting stuff!
"Aqaba! By Land!" T. E. Lawrence

R. Peters

Axil
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Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:34 am

Post by Axil »

rjaypeters wrote:
Joseph Chikva wrote:May be you have your personal Large Hadrons Collider?
Shape of nucleus?
Now I understand why a number of undergrad guys look at you as on a great physicist.
Some people claim to some understanding of the subject, at least enough to write books about the geometry of atomic nuclei:

"Models of the Atomic Nucleus: with interactive software, Volume 1
By Norman D. Cook"

which Google Search was kind enough to show some pages when I searched for "atomic nucleus geometry." There is at least one description of the Euclidean geometry of the particles in the nucleus. Since the title of the book includes plural models, the face-centered cubic structure described in Chapter 9 may not be the last word on the subject (though the face-centered cubic structure does exhibit octahedral symmetry, hmm).

Then, there is this guy:

"Ben Roy Mottelson (born July 9, 1926) is a Danish American nuclear physicist. He won the 1975 Nobel Prize in Physics for his work on the non-spherical geometry of atomic nuclei."

[snip of biographical info]

"In 1950-51, James Rainwater and Aage Bohr had developed models of the atomic nucleus which began to take into account the behaviour of the individual nucleons. These models, which moved beyond the simpler liquid drop treatment of the nucleus as having effectively no internal structure, were the first models which could explain a number of nuclear properties, including the non-spherical distribution of charge in certain nuclei. Mottelson worked with Aage Bohr to compare the theoretical models with experimental data. In three papers which were published in 1952-53, Bohr and Mottelson demonstrated close agreement between theory and experiment, for example showing that the energy levels of certain nuclei could be described by a rotation spectrum. This work stimulated new theoretical and experimental studies.

Rainwater, Bohr and Mottelson were jointly awarded the 1975 Nobel Prize in Physics "for the discovery of the connection between collective motion and particle motion in atomic nuclei and the development of the theory of the structure of the atomic nucleus based on this connection".[1]

Bohr and Mottelson continued to work together, publishing a two-volume monograph, Nuclear Structure. The first volume, Single-Particle Motion, appeared in 1969, and the second volume, Nuclear Deformations, in 1975." from Dr. Mottelson's Wikipedia entry.

So there's enough to read for awhile. I love you guys, you cause me to look up the most interesting stuff!
I am also interested in the structure of the nucleus. I hope you would be gracious enough to share your speculations from time to time as a platform for thought. Contrary to the common academic disposition, I am receptive to any speculation recognizing that such speculation may be acting as a mere stepping stone for further thought and conceptual development.

I believe that the physics of condensed matter may provide addition insights into the workings of the atom over what is afforded by high energy nuclear reactions.

For one thing, I read somewhere (I don’t remember where) that protons are highly attracted to neutrons in complex nuclei.

In the hydrogen only Rossi reaction that I believe predominates, neutrons must come from somewhere. How they come to be is undetermined.

The Copper transmutation reaction might only be a high energy proton secondary reaction that the hydrogen only reaction drives. Rossi might have it backwards where he thinks nickel fusion causes the formation of light elements. Under my hydrogen only conjecture, light element fusion forms copper from nickel via fast protons collisions.

For example, see the following:

http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-02-bou ... -free.html
For those interested, a mathematical description of the EMC effect is here:


On the dependence of the wave function of a bound nucleon on its momentum and the EMC effect


http://arxiv.org/pdf/0706.2937

Ivy Matt
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Post by Ivy Matt »

parallel wrote:Bloggers in need of something to read could try the discussion page on wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Energy_Catalyzer I thought it interesting that Brian Josephson (yes the famous one) is a strong supporter of Rossi. He also described the demonstrations as scientific experiments, but what would he know compare to our resident pathological skeptics?
Alas, I have a similar problem with Josephson as I have with Rossi. He piqued people's curiosity with this little exchange, then refused to get specific, so I would have to argue that that hypothesis of his (or of his friend's friend, or whoever) is not among his greater contributions to science. In most other respects I have no objection to his actions moderating the Wikipedia article on the E-Cat, although I would reserve the phrase "experiment" for those Rossi is alleged to have carried out before he started doing demonstrations.

Speaking of pathological skeptics, Peter Ekström recently published an article on Rossi's E-Cat in Fysikaktuellt, a publication of the Swedish Physical Society. There are links and an English translation here. His conclusion:
There are too many uncertainties with the E-Cat to believe that this is something more than a scam, probably ultimately intended to get into venture capital. This is now pretty common ploy, not only in the energy sector but subjects in areas such as IT and Nano.
Well, at least that's better than "definitely a scam". :P
parallel wrote:Earlier, someone doubted that an E-Cat has been used to power a factory. The address is given in Rossi's patent.
A practical embodiment of the inventive apparatus, installed on October 16, 2007, is at present perfectly operating 24 hours per day, and provides an amount of heat sufficient to heat the factory of the Company EON of via Carlo Ragazzi 18, at Bondeno (Province of Ferrara).
Curious that noone has taken the trouble to go and look at it. Must be easier to stay seated and write how it is all a fairy tale.
Right then, I'll head over there as soon as I've completed my prototype Gravity Portal.
Temperature, density, confinement time: pick any two.

parallel
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Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:24 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA

Post by parallel »

Ivy Matt,
Alas, I have a similar problem with Josephson as I have with Rossi. He piqued people's curiosity with this little exchange, then refused to get specific, so I would have to argue that that hypothesis of his (or of his friend's friend, or whoever) is not among his greater contributions to science.
I don't think there is much doubt that the hot fusion folk were deriding cold fusion and did their share of dirty deeds shooting down P&F in 1989.
I've read the story of MIT altering the results they found doing the replication, to hide the anomalous heat, and the party afterwards.

You judge things on credibility yet don't seem to recognize that when $ billions are at stake funny things do happen. My guess is that Josephson found it too dangerous/undesirable to be more specific. I have no reason to doubt that he has heard "rumors."

raphael
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Post by raphael »

Ekstrom was, at one point, quite dismissive of Rossi's claims. At a later point, he seemed to have become much more neutral on the issue. Has he now gone back into a highly dismissive mode?
"As long as the roots are not severed, all is well. And all will be well in the garden." Chauncey Gardiner

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