"I'm back from Via dell'Elettricista [Rossi's factory location in Bologna]. What Sterling Allan says is what Rossi said during the "press conference", so it's the truth, for what it's worth. I can confirm that steam couldn't be seen as it was being condensed. Measurements should have been done by a certain engineer Fioravanti (I believe on behalf of the "very important customer"). Not everything went well (the usual [leaking] gaskets, the self-sustaining reaction that was in danger of runaway, etc), but 470kWh (even if not 1 MWh) without input power (excluding that of water pumps) couldn't leave room for doubts. Rossi will send a report (written by the customer's consultants) to the attendees, but he's already read it aloud entirely during the press conference in both Italian/English versions.
There were many Swedes.
Stremmenos, Levi, Ferrari were quite serene and attentive. Anyhow, either everybody made arrangements [to fake a succesful test] or it's all true."
10KW LENR demonstrator (new thread)
Some confirmation.
If the customer is a confederate, then why would they claim only 470 KW?And if the "customer" is a confederate? I has happened before.
That does not make sense. A clever scammer might claim 850 KW or so, but not less than half, something that only keeps fueling the doubt.
Personally, I am less and less convinced of a scam. For me it is now:
60% that it is real
15% that it is a scam
and
25% that it is self delusion
Keep the snide remarks coming, the showing of your intelligence is amazing! As for your proof today, it's a Pro-Rossi news group posting that Rossi said everything worked well and that he not-so-secretly sold his prototype to a secret company. Until we know which company, all this information is completely useless speculation.parallel wrote:ScottL
Who cares if you can't wait?
*Golf Clap*
Can anybody explain whats lends more credibility to the so-called 1MW plant than to the elementary E-Cat, as regards measurement accuracy ? Especially, knowing the 1MW plant is simply a cascade of elementary E-Cats.
Perhaps the law of large numbers?
Perhaps the law of large numbers?
Last edited by olivier on Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:30 pm, edited 4 times in total.
The skeptics didn't believe the 3kW from the Oct 6th test. "Measurement error."olivier wrote:Can anybody explain whats lends more credibility to the so-called 1MW plant than to the elementary E-Cat, as regards measurement accuracy ? Especially, knowing the 1MW plant is simply a cascade of elementary E-Cats.
Perhaps the law of large numbers?
It gets more difficult to explain away 470kW. Even so, the real naysayers still won't be convinced even by this.
As Rossi says, the only acceptable proof will be multiple sales to satisfied customers.
I mean - it hasn't been peer reviewed - so you just KNOW it is a scam.
The biggest advantage would be sufficient proof that ScottL would stop posting space wasting rubbish. As he promised to do several times already.
From an engineering stand point, the smaller e-cat was the logical choice for showing proof. After Rossi's remarks regarding pressure being the key, I believe he's made a container of decently insulated pressure vessels which would allow for the water to boil for sustained periods. The result we're looking for is how long the test went for and the view of the release of steam. It should be very telling to see the volume of steam over a given period of time.olivier wrote:Can anybody explain whats lends more credibility to the so-called 1MW plant than to the elementary E-Cat, as regards measurement accuracy ? Especially, knowing the 1MW plant is simply a cascade of elementary E-Cats.
Perhaps the law of large numbers?
Hopefully there will be video along with the data.
Keep trolling, it suits your lack of engineering knowledge well. As per the question, Parallel is wrong, again. The values can be explained away easier by the complexity of the system (1MW, several ecats, piping, etc.) The best unit of measure is and always will be the individual unit. This is engineering 101, if your base case can't be proven, then your entire system can't be proven.parallel wrote:The skeptics didn't believe the 3kW from the Oct 6th test. "Measurement error."olivier wrote:Can anybody explain whats lends more credibility to the so-called 1MW plant than to the elementary E-Cat, as regards measurement accuracy ? Especially, knowing the 1MW plant is simply a cascade of elementary E-Cats.
Perhaps the law of large numbers?
It gets more difficult to explain away 470kW. Even so, the real naysayers still won't be convinced even by this.
As Rossi says, the only acceptable proof will be multiple sales to satisfied customers.
I mean - it hasn't been peer reviewed - so you just KNOW it is a scam.
The biggest advantage would be sufficient proof that ScottL would stop posting space wasting rubbish. As he promised to do several times already.
Parallel, I'm glad you like to dabble in psuedo-engineering, but when it comes to answers, please leave it to certified engineers and those with degrees in such.
So it seems Rossi's 1MW (478kW) is about proving SCALING ... and if you believe Rossi like you would believe polywell's Rick (I forget his name) he has done that.
Recall 'scaling' is something polyapologist's got giddy over when somehow gleaned secondhand from naval financial records.
Yet here they are bashing a guy who has the guts to come out and say what he is doing ...
... beggars belief the hypocrisy on display here.
Edit: not to single out polyweller's too much tokomak fusioneer's are worse, rossi's thing if it makes it to market will confine them all to a footnote in the history of ever more big, bad govt. science.
Recall 'scaling' is something polyapologist's got giddy over when somehow gleaned secondhand from naval financial records.
Yet here they are bashing a guy who has the guts to come out and say what he is doing ...
... beggars belief the hypocrisy on display here.
Edit: not to single out polyweller's too much tokomak fusioneer's are worse, rossi's thing if it makes it to market will confine them all to a footnote in the history of ever more big, bad govt. science.
Last edited by icarus on Fri Oct 28, 2011 10:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Rossi was talking total BS there. Maybe he was partying to much with that spumante before that interview?
I mean "total free energy"? "not using any fuel"?
I guess he meant no input power was needed, but that did not come over..
That man just is doing a really, really bad job at selling whatever he does or does not have.
I mean "total free energy"? "not using any fuel"?
I guess he meant no input power was needed, but that did not come over..
That man just is doing a really, really bad job at selling whatever he does or does not have.
I don't remember any Polywell proponent on this forum saying Polywell works. Most are skeptical as theyshould be and have stated that if the predicted scaling law turns out true, then yes it could work, otherwise, it was just another way not to do something. The big difference here is that EMC2 is attempting to prove a scaling law they willfully admit to, while Rossi is trying to prove his device does anything, scaled or otherwise. Vastly different experiments and vastly different proponents.icarus wrote:So it seems Rossi's 1MW (478kW) is about proving SCALING ... and if you believe Rossi like you would believe polywell's Rick (I forget his name) he has done that.
Recall 'scaling' is something polyapologist's got giddy over when somehow gleaned secondhand from naval financial records.
Yet here they are bashing a guy who has the guts to come out and say what he is doing ...
... beggars belief the hypocrisy on display here.
Edit: not to single out polyweller's too much tokomak fusioneer's are worse, rossi's thing if it makes it to market will confine them all to a footnote in the history of ever more big, bad govt. science.
At what point did Polywell become a contraversy on the internet? At what point did EMC2 claim to have a working device? When did they make a big spectacle of a demonstration, or better yet when have they publically demonstrated their device?
I suppose you haven't been around here long enough to know the full polywell story ... it is not as sweet smelling as you might be lead to believe. Ask the Navy guys what's really going on.ScottL wrote:I don't remember any Polywell proponent on this forum saying Polywell works. Most are skeptical as theyshould be and have stated that if the predicted scaling law turns out true, then yes it could work, otherwise, it was just another way not to do something. The big difference here is that EMC2 is attempting to prove a scaling law they willfully admit to, while Rossi is trying to prove his device does anything, scaled or otherwise. Vastly different experiments and vastly different proponents.icarus wrote:So it seems Rossi's 1MW (478kW) is about proving SCALING ... and if you believe Rossi like you would believe polywell's Rick (I forget his name) he has done that.
Recall 'scaling' is something polyapologist's got giddy over when somehow gleaned secondhand from naval financial records.
Yet here they are bashing a guy who has the guts to come out and say what he is doing ...
... beggars belief the hypocrisy on display here.
Edit: not to single out polyweller's too much tokomak fusioneer's are worse, rossi's thing if it makes it to market will confine them all to a footnote in the history of ever more big, bad govt. science.
At what point did Polywell become a contraversy on the internet? At what point did EMC2 claim to have a working device? When did they make a big spectacle of a demonstration, or better yet when have they publically demonstrated their device?
More footage from Bologna ...
http://youtu.be/uFiJb2UhzqY
EXCUSE ME FOLKS
Assuming this this is actually working (which I am not ready to accept yet) all the chatter about "ONLY" 470kW is disengenuous.
Rossi claimed he would provide 1MW with a certain amount of input. What got reported was 470 with ZERO input. What was its output with nominal input? Could it be "1MW out with 200kW in" or "470 out with zero in" or some variation on that theme. So far, still no real data.
Assuming this this is actually working (which I am not ready to accept yet) all the chatter about "ONLY" 470kW is disengenuous.
Rossi claimed he would provide 1MW with a certain amount of input. What got reported was 470 with ZERO input. What was its output with nominal input? Could it be "1MW out with 200kW in" or "470 out with zero in" or some variation on that theme. So far, still no real data.