Boyd Bushman at LockMart

[GIThruster]

The distance of the craft that stalked the RB-47 for ah hour and a half, across 700 miles and over 4 states, is not in question. They had precise range to the craft both with their air to air radar, and with the ground radar. Certainly it was more than just some lights in the sky, and it was much faster than the B-47. And just to note, at this time in history, the fastest plane we made was the B-47. Besides, our aircraft can't make right angle turns in the sky. It wasn't one of ours.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/rb47.html

[MSimon]

The distance of the craft that stalked the RB-47 for ah hour and a half, across 700 miles and over 4 states, is not in question. They had precise range to the craft both with their air to air radar, and with the ground radar. Certainly it was more than just some lights in the sky, and it was much faster than the B-47. And just to note, at this time in history, the fastest plane we made was the B-47. Besides, our aircraft can't make right angle turns in the sky. It wasn't one of ours.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/rb47.html

I'd be inclined to credit ball lightning or some similar phenomenon. I am one of the few humans to actually experience natural ball lightning. It developed inside my dome home in Carbondale, Illinois (around '73 or '74) after a lightning strike hit my grounded ham antenna. The antenna was about 80 ft long and 7ft above the ground IIRC.

The ball glowed green and lasted about 5 or 10 seconds. It moved slowly towards me as I backed away. And then dissipated.

The atmospheric potential gradient is quite large. No reason cosmic rays couldn't discharge it locally. But that is probably rare. Which is why we don't get these reports often. I would expect a plasma could maneuver in ways never seen before. And it could have natural frequencies. We know Polywell does.

[DeltaV]

And just to note, at this time in history, the fastest plane we made was the B-47.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Amer ... uper_Sabre
http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/m-60.html

[Betruger]

But can they pull 90's?

The other side of the equation matters too. Could some fluke explain the radar as a misread? Pioneer only seemed like an anomaly.

[GIThruster]

And just to note, at this time in history, the fastest plane we made was the B-47.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Amer ... uper_Sabre
http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/m-60.html

Guess I should have checked my source. My father flew on an RB-47 in Korea, and he told me it was the fastest plane of its time, but it appears it was no longer so in 1957. Good catch. Still, we didn't have any aircraft that could do what that thing did, and ball lighting does not travel at such speeds, last for 90 minutes or track on radar. And note, it was tracked BOTH on the ground and in the air for very long periods of time. USAF has no explanation for the event.

[Diogenes]

The distance of the craft that stalked the RB-47 for ah hour and a half, across 700 miles and over 4 states, is not in question. They had precise range to the craft both with their air to air radar, and with the ground radar. Certainly it was more than just some lights in the sky, and it was much faster than the B-47. And just to note, at this time in history, the fastest plane we made was the B-47. Besides, our aircraft can't make right angle turns in the sky. It wasn't one of ours.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/rb47.html

From what I have read of your commentary, it seems that you believe in the flying saucer phenomena. I believe there is something going on, but I am not at all clear on what it is.



Do you think we are being visited by aliens from another star? If so, are we speculating that they don't want to make broader contact with humanity because of a Star Trek like prime directive?



Why do they put on a show then?


There is much about this whole issue that seems mutually contradictory. It occurs to me that for a species that has mastered star travel, Earth would be nothing more than a curiosity, or perhaps a tourist trap where the superior aliens can entertain themselves watching us primitive earthlings live our neanderthal lives.


I guess it's better than soap operas.

[GIThruster]

Do you think we are being visited by aliens from another star?

Yes.

If so, are we speculating that they don't want to make broader contact with humanity because of a Star Trek like prime directive?

They are forbidden contact with us, just as we're forbidden contact with them. Don't you read your Bible? It is for this reason we only have contact with those that are in rebellion against proper Authority, and are violating the directive. Rare exceptions would be things like Gabriel appearing to Daniel, but generally contact is not permitted. It's important to note though, that in every instance of authentic special revelation as defined in theology, all revelation is contact. No exceptions. And the Bible alone is pretty big. Why would you say there's no contact? From the very first pages of the Bible to the last, Angels are flying about shouting "Holy, Holy, Holy! is the Lord God Almighty! The whole world is full of his glory!". How does that sound like lack of contact?

Why do they put on a show then?

I'm sure there are a host of reasons for the "show" as you put it. Could be there are as many reasons as there are sightings. It is worth noting here that there is an intergalactic war going on. These folks don't get along, and they are fighting over the simplest of disagreements like the nature of good and evil. You will find real information about these things in the religious literature of the world, from the Hebrew Bible to the Hindu Vedas. Why anyone would think they should ignore all this and pretend to be above them is beyond me. Modern man is not "above" ancient man in understanding life's simplest matters. Modern man is below him. Just because anthropomorphism can explain a thing, doesn't mean it explains every sighting, every piece of myth, every bit of religion, etc. Only fools believe that sort of thing and we have a lot of fools around today.

There is much about this whole issue that seems mutually contradictory.

Like what?

It occurs to me that for a species that has mastered star travel, Earth would be nothing more than a curiosity, or perhaps a tourist trap where the superior aliens can entertain themselves watching us primitive earthlings live our neanderthal lives.

You misunderstand. We are a curiosity no doubt, but we are likely the Universe's prime curiosity right now. All these creatures involved in a moral war for millennia--who knows how long--look at us in pure wonder since we are this strange mixture. Not only do we not stand forward like some homogeneous group, we murder each other daily, and take from each other, and yet are also capable of fantastical compassion, wisdom, etc. We're the Universe's best drama, sitcom, crime show and documentary all rolled into one. Things into which "angels long to look but do not understand." And we are in some sense the testbed for morality, since we get all kinds. There are literally hundreds if not thousands of specific case studies in morality and ethics, politics and belief of all kinds, that get played out in our lives and end up demonstrating the proof of good and evil's results. We're an indispensable laboratory experiment, and the souls of the mice running the maze are the main prize and ill gotten gains that will fail to comfort those who take charge of them eventually.

“It is a serious thing to live in a society of possible gods and goddesses, to remember that the dullest most uninteresting person you talk to may one day be a creature which, if you saw it now, you would be strongly tempted to worship, or else a horror and a corruption such as you now meet, if at all, only in a nightmare. All day long we are, in some degree helping each other to one or the other of these destinations. It is in the light of these overwhelming possibilites, it is with the awe and the circumspection proper to them, that we should conduct all of our dealings with one another, all friendships, all loves, all play, all politics. There are no ordinary people. You have never talked to a mere mortal. nations, cultures, arts, civilizations - These are mortal, and their life is to ours as the life of a gnat. But it is immortals whom we joke with, work with, marry, snub, and exploit - immortal horrors or everlasting splendors.”

C. S. Lewis--The Weight of Glory

[Betruger]

There's something a bit incredible about considering ourselves So darn Special that - without religious assumptions, anyway - aliens would somehow admire or otherwise be captivated by our livelihood.

[GIThruster]

That's true. If there weren't special revelation that specifically says Angels to not understand grace and forgiveness, and they long to look into such things as a result, I would not buy that part of the story, but as it is, that kind of detail gives credibility to the story as it demonstrates a working knowledge of how these aliens/angels think. Certainly I am not surprised when someone who is an atheist and ignorant of the Bible balks at such things, but just saying, that's in the book.

[Betruger]

A supernatural thing is supposed to corroborate the alien conjecture?

[Skipjack]

http://www.snopes.com/photos/odd/bushman.asp

[D Tibbets]

A radar trace, even if verified does not necessarily have to indicate an object. Radar signals can respond to various conditions. Perhaps the most obvious is plasmas. Look up NexRad radars producing plasma balls. A questioned radar return could be the result of an alian spacecraft (I guess they never heard of stealth technology), other unidentified aircraft, atmospheric effects- either natural or induced by the questioned radar or other radar, radar malfuntion, etc..

I bet the experts in radar jamming could give all sorts of ways to block, disable, spoof, mislead, or otherwise render useless radar detection. Then they could give all sorts of ways to counter those efforts, then give ways to counter those countermeasure efforts, etc.

Dan Tibbets

[GIThruster]

It was not only a radar contact tracked from both air and ground that moved with the plane for 90 minutes, there was also a signal coming from the craft in addition to the track.

How much evidence is enough evidence? Plasma? In what universe can plasma explain such a thing? Nonsense.