The trend is clear...

[DeltaV]

The US has abandoned the stars and opted instead for a bloated, wasteful, generally-ineffective medical welfare/insurance/litigation system:

[ladajo]

We are well on the path of losing the innovation culture, and becoming the dependancy culture. Everyone will be dependant on others to exist. Lost will be the idea of being able to fend for yourself.
Sad.

[Teahive]

The US has abandoned the stars and opted instead for a bloated, wasteful, generally-ineffective medical welfare/insurance/litigation system:

I'm not sure how the chart is related to this point.

[DeltaV]

NIH would not get big money unless medicine was big business.

I've made the assumption here that medical research funding levels increase with the revenues associated with the medical industry (including the lawyers, pharmaceuticals, regulatory agencies, etc.). Trust me, it is an industry.

With that assumption, an inverse correlation is clear. Cause and effect cannot be deduced from that, but the end result is equivalent to taking NASA's money and giving it to NIH.

[Teahive]

NIH would not get big money unless medicine was big business.

Indeed, but that's not automatically the same as a "bloated, wasteful, generally-ineffective medical welfare/insurance/litigation system".

I'm not saying that it isn't, just that the chart doesn't show that. On the other hand, I'd be rather concerned if medicine wasn't a growing industry.

[DeltaV]

@teahive -
OK, I see your point. You can't jump to that from the data. I'm biased by what my father went through prior to his death, so I guess I'm not an impartial observer.

[GIThruster]

It's not much a grasp to see waste. Every day I see elderly folks who can walk just fine using $1,000 electric wheelchairs and scooters paid for by medicaid. How is that in the nations interest? It's not even in those persons interest as they need the exercise they're now not getting.

[MSimon]

And the Medical system doesn't like competition from plants:

CB1

CB2

Changes in endocannabinoid levels and/or CB2 receptor expressions have been reported in almost all diseases affecting humans,[34] ranging from cardiovascular, gastrointestinal, liver, kidney, neurodegenerative, psychiatric, bone, skin, autoimmune, lung disorders to pain and cancer. The prevalence of this trend suggests that modulating CB2 receptor activity by either selective CB2 receptor agonists or inverse agonists/antagonists depending on the disease and its progression holds unique therapeutic potential for these pathologies [34]

http://classicalvalues.com/2013/02/cb2/

=====

Why would they want competition from plants when they can sell medicine for a dollar a dose that can be grown for a tenth of a cent a dose? And to think that we have Conservatives supporting this. Well they are conserving the medical industrial complex so there is that.

=====

The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected. Even when the revolutionist might himself repent of his revolution, the traditionalist is already defending it as part of his tradition. Thus we have two great types -- the advanced person who rushes us into ruin, and the retrospective person who admires the ruins. He admires them especially by moonlight, not to say moonshine. Each new blunder of the progressive or prig becomes instantly a legend of immemorial antiquity for the snob. This is called the balance, or mutual check, in our Constitution. — G.K. Chesterton

[Diogenes]

It's not much a grasp to see waste. Every day I see elderly folks who can walk just fine using $1,000 electric wheelchairs and scooters paid for by medicaid. How is that in the nations interest? It's not even in those persons interest as they need the exercise they're now not getting.

The plot of this graph is a crash.

[MSimon]

It's not much a grasp to see waste. Every day I see elderly folks who can walk just fine using $1,000 electric wheelchairs and scooters paid for by medicaid. How is that in the nations interest? It's not even in those persons interest as they need the exercise they're now not getting.

The plot of this graph is a crash.

Oil production in the US peaked in 1972. I think that is significant.

With a new resurgence of production we may be heading back up the peak. And even Calif may be getting it.

Golden State lawmakers reluctantly face the economic facts.

[Diogenes]

It's not much a grasp to see waste. Every day I see elderly folks who can walk just fine using $1,000 electric wheelchairs and scooters paid for by medicaid. How is that in the nations interest? It's not even in those persons interest as they need the exercise they're now not getting.

The plot of this graph is a crash.

Oil production in the US peaked in 1972. I think that is significant.

With a new resurgence of production we may be heading back up the peak. And even Calif may be getting it.

Golden State lawmakers reluctantly face the economic facts.

One of the things I regard as absolutely essential to pulling out of this nose dive is the stimulated production of Oil/Gas energy. The Bakken Fields in North Dakota are a Godsend, as is the Canadian oil which is coming on line. Cheap energy fuels the United States, and I thought that with Romney cutting spending, and the US again exporting oil, we just MIGHT be able to grow the economy faster than the crash can overtake us. (With a good side effect of cutting some throats in the middle east that badly need cutting.)


With the current Bozo in charge, I don't think it's possible.

And California doing something sensible? That'll be the day.

[MSimon]

I don't think Romney was into cutting. He was into better managing the decline than Obozo. In fact that is what the Republicans have been doing ever since Wilson.

I think Rand Paul might do a lot better given the fact that he grew up in a Libertarian milieu. Those folks are just vicious when it comes to cutting government. Which is why I'm no longer a Republican. I appreciate all those who chased me away. You have done me a service.

So how do we pay for all the social programs we will have to maintain until they expire?

The government owns a LOT of land. Sell it.

[Diogenes]

I don't think Romney was into cutting. He was into better managing the decline than Obozo. In fact that is what the Republicans have been doing ever since Wilson.

Spending government money has long had it's own constituency in both parties, and that constituency has the most influence it appears.

I think Rand Paul might do a lot better given the fact that he grew up in a Libertarian milieu. Those folks are just vicious when it comes to cutting government. Which is why I'm no longer a Republican. I appreciate all those who chased me away. You have done me a service.

Every time I think you might be reasoned with, you remind me why you can't.

So how do we pay for all the social programs we will have to maintain until they expire?

A basic argument of conservative principles is that most of those social programs are both unconstitutional, and would be bad policy even if they weren't. Social programs pretty much began under Roosevelt (Social Security) and Lyndon Johnson ( Medicare, Welfare.)


All of those programs should never have been started, and now they need to be shut down. A friend (who reads this site) pointed out to me that there is a recent article which argues that Medicare created a market price floor for medical care that has had the real world effect of forcing prices ever upward. (Unintended consequences are a b*tch)

Those programs are bankrupting the Financial system of this nation, and the trends indicate the problem can only grow worse.

The government owns a LOT of land. Sell it

Will only solve the problem temporarily. As we have been saying since before Reagan, the problem is not that the government has to little money, the problem is that the government spends too much.

[Skipjack]

Only that the administrations original plan had an increase of funding for NASA until congress reduced it. Just saying.

[MSimon]

Will only solve the problem temporarily.

It only has to be done once if done right. End the programs (you may have to adjust that - say for people over 45) and pay for those still in them with the land. Sell enough every year to pay for the spending.

BTW I'm open to reason. You just haven't presented ones that convince me.

I always work to improve my messaging. It is how I got Polywell refunded. I kept adjusting my message to handle comments and objections.

I operate on the principle that if my message is not getting through it is my fault.